Author Topic: proviz fully reflective jackets  (Read 8759 times)

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #25 on: January 26, 2020, 06:07:32 pm »
First impression on trying it on is that the fit is... unusual.
In what way?
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2020, 06:09:21 pm »
While proviz imitations have now become high street fashion, I don't think we'll be seeing many of them on the school run yet, as lots of school uniform rules still mandate black coats.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #27 on: January 26, 2020, 06:09:42 pm »
My 2 Castelli jackets (Mortirolo Reflex and Raddoppia) have copious quantities of a similar highly-reflective material on the tail and shoulders. They really glare out when illuminated (as if battery powered).  Several years old now and not a mark on them. Certainly no tears or  scuffing even though I wear them throughout the winter months.

Cost me no more than these Proviz ones.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #28 on: January 26, 2020, 06:33:13 pm »
While proviz imitations have now become high street fashion, I don't think we'll be seeing many of them on the school run yet, as lots of school uniform rules still mandate black coats.

I've seen a few of the local teenagers wearing such.  But possibly only the ones from schools with sensible uniform rules.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2020, 06:42:47 pm »
There must be some.  ;) If they're older teenagers, Post-16 Centres (that have replaced sixth forms) tend to have more sensible uniform rules, if any.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

mmmmartin

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2020, 10:43:31 pm »
I have the one with yellow inside so you can reverse it. the yellow is good in daylight, the silvery is great in the dark. It is a bit boil-in-the-bag. Bit good for being seen. I recently bought a Gore Shakedry on eBay: more comfy but much less see-able: so I'll wear a high-viz gilet over it. But these things  ake riding to the pub in the dark safer. Not as safe as riding on the pavement though. But I do both.
Besides, it wouldn't be audacious if success were guaranteed.

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #31 on: January 28, 2020, 01:06:03 pm »
I'm developing a theory on hi-viz.

It gives the driver complete perspective of you and your position and from that they interpret your speed (slow, in their opinion). This means you are where they expect you to be when they catch you up so they have done all of this in their head and as they consider themselves to be brilliant drivers they don't bother to lift off the throttle.

I have reflective tape on my mudguard, saddle bag and seat stays. There is some reflective writing on all of my gear and my shoes and overshoes also have reflective material. I have a fixed dynamo rear light and two separate flashing battery lights facing the rear.

The two different flashing lights disturb the depth perception. The drivers can clearly see there is a cyclist ahead but without a definitive position on the road it creates a niggling doubt in the drivers mind. They therefore lift a little until they are confident.

My unscientific testing on the dark lanes I ride on suggests I get less close passes and the passing traffic is slower when I am not wearing hi-viz.

In town I think it's a bit different as the hi-viz stands out against the glare of other car lights, street lights etc but 7 out of 15 miles of my commute is on country roads where I feel more vulnerable and I prefer to not wear my hi-viz.
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Kim

  • Timelord
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #32 on: January 28, 2020, 01:11:24 pm »
It's like the recumbent WTF-factor.  Anything that causes the driver to do a little thinking generally helps.  Anything that changes their priority from must-get-in-front to want-to-get-a-better-look is a massive win.

As such, I expect that the first time they encounter a Provis, they'll be interested in the unusual jacket and slow down accordingly.  The tenth time, not so much.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #33 on: January 28, 2020, 06:40:43 pm »
I was recently driving my car on a road just outside my village. There is a path on the LHS and I spotted two runners on it running towards me. They looked to both be wearing the Proviz type of jacket and they were highly visible from a long way off as the reflective qualities of their jackets were so good.

What took me much longer to see, and if I'm honest rather later than I would have liked was the third runner with no reflective gear (or none that I could see in the reflective blast I got from the other two) who was running alongside them - this one on the road though.

Couldn't help think that he would have been better off swapping places with one of the others on the path.

I also wondered if this 'reflected' the situation with bike lights/vehicle lights and the need for cyclists to be visible against the background of vehicle DRLs etc  ;D

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #34 on: January 29, 2020, 08:12:36 pm »
I think the novelty, shine and omnidirectional reflection all add upto a large bright object. This is interpreted as “large” especially on my narrow roads.

The problem is that the material is very heavy and breathes less than a pac-a-mac from the 70s.

I am seriously thinking of cutting the sleeve off and just using the sleeve with a normal jacket.

Diesel

  • or Richard
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2020, 08:22:42 pm »
I've got 2 of these Gillets. The first developed a hole so Pro-Viz replaced it and let me upgrade to their performance model

On the plus side, they are very visible and it does seem that some drivers give you more space and attention than when I'm wearing other hi viz.

But they are too boil in the bag for me. The performance one is better but still I end up sweating at times. I can't wear it all night on a ride as I just can't temperature regulate well enough in it once I'm tired or cold.

So I use it for local rides short night sections but that's it.

Shame as I'd really like it to work better.

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2020, 09:32:32 pm »
I rode behind someone in a Proviz jacket in the final miles of the ACME event this month. On country roads, riding up to 200m ahead of me, he was like a brightly-shining ghost, even when seemingly out of reach of my, or any other, light. I was so impressed that I've bought one of the reversible gilets (albeit in CycleSurgery's closing-down sale, so at a discount). I've only worn it for work so far. I agree that it could get rather boil-in-the-bag over longer distances. But I may take it for the final miles of the next ACME this Saturday, and see how it goes.

Redlight

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #37 on: January 30, 2020, 01:19:29 pm »
First impression on trying it on is that the fit is... unusual.
In what way?

The body length is fine but it's very snug around the armpits and the sleeves seem disproportionately long.
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Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #38 on: January 30, 2020, 05:19:11 pm »
First impression on trying it on is that the fit is... unusual.
In what way?

The body length is fine but it's very snug around the armpits and the sleeves seem disproportionately long.
That's a good warning for me then, I don't get on with overly long sleeves. Spose I could think about one of the gillets.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #39 on: January 30, 2020, 05:34:37 pm »
The full proviz jacket seems a bit much, as I prefer a mix of hi-vis + reflectives for gloomy + dark.  May look at the proviz gilet.   Have tried to add stick (iron) on reflective strip on yellow hi-vis and it works well - though not so good on items that get washed  (as gloves/skull cap).
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Regulator

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #40 on: February 01, 2020, 10:37:21 am »
I was driving behind someone in a Provis 360 jacket the other night.   I saw them clearly a long way off.  Probably one of the most effective reflective jackets I’ve ever seen. 
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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #41 on: February 01, 2020, 11:50:08 am »
Retroreflectives work by taking the light that would normally be reflected in all directions and reflecting it all back towards the light source. That means in any situation where the viewer and the light source are in different directions, they're actually a cloak of darkness.

I've never quite been able to articulate a scenario where this presents a danger to the rider, but it's always bothered me.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #42 on: February 01, 2020, 01:19:45 pm »
Retroreflectives work by taking the light that would normally be reflected in all directions and reflecting it all back towards the light source. That means in any situation where the viewer and the light source are in different directions, they're actually a cloak of darkness.

Demonstrably untrue.  A Provis jacket appears grey under indirect illumination, not black.

A more substantial failing is the absence of fluorescent material which would be more useful than reflective in twilight conditions. 

But this all assumes that hi-vis is of benefit in the first place.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #43 on: February 01, 2020, 03:43:20 pm »
I have had a Provis jacket for a while now.  I've not worn it much but when I have I've been impressed.  It has to be raining hard for me to don any sort of waterproof as I sweat quite a bit so am normally damp, modest amounts of rain doesn't make that much difference.  The jacket does feel a little heavier than other waterproofs I've had, I suppose its the super reflective material.

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #44 on: February 01, 2020, 03:46:03 pm »
I have seen a Madison jacket of which the top half was not-quite fluorescent orange and lower half all-round reflective. Or it could have been the other way round, but either way, the division included the arms.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #45 on: February 01, 2020, 06:00:48 pm »
Demonstrably untrue.  A Provis jacket appears grey under indirect illumination, not black.

Well, relatively speaking. If you're concerned about visibility, buying a jacket that's an all over dull grey when it's not doing its retroreflective thing seems an odd choice.

Quote
A more substantial failing is the absence of fluorescent material which would be more useful than reflective in twilight conditions.

Exactly this. IIRC the first gen Proviz gear had both reflective and hi viz areas, but looking at their website now the novelty all-over retro-reflectives have clearly won.

(saying all this, I wear a lot of black and make up for it with bright dynamo lights day and night, not that an attentive driver should need either...)

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #46 on: February 02, 2020, 07:37:00 pm »
The odd thing about these jackets is that they weren't around back in 2003 when REM did Happy Shiny People.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #47 on: February 02, 2020, 08:53:55 pm »
The odd thing about these jackets is that they weren't around back in 2003 when REM did Happy Shiny People.

At risk of outing myself as an REM fan, that song's from *checks notes* 1991.

Also, it's about the Tiananmen Square protests.  If you're going to face down a tank, it's always a good idea to wear hi-vis.  Or something.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #48 on: February 03, 2020, 08:55:24 am »
That's the risk of Google. Might even have been Wikipedia. I'd have said "1990s" but checked and found 2003.

Also, during one of the invasions of Iraq (they seem to be happening all the time, but this was the big one that was on TV with "embedded reporters") we were told how the Usukozetc tanks did literally have hi-viz markings on their roofs as a precaution against being shot at by their own aircraft. Apparently the Iraqi airforce didn't exist (can't remember whether they'd all been destroyed or what). So even tanks need hi-vis.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: proviz fully reflective jackets
« Reply #49 on: February 03, 2020, 12:05:19 pm »
That's the risk of Google. Might even have been Wikipedia. I'd have said "1990s" but checked and found 2003.

It appears that some muppets did a cover or put it on a compilation album or something.  No idea if they were wearing hi-vis.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...