Author Topic: Tubeless for Dummies  (Read 87755 times)

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #875 on: November 14, 2018, 11:42:22 am »
It is also very expensive

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #876 on: November 14, 2018, 12:08:05 pm »
To get back on track. I was seduced by the claims of finish line Kevlar sealant. I put it into two new tyres on rims that were designed for tubeless. The rear tyre has stayed up but the front has deflated on 5 successive days despite in excess of 100km and multiple re inflations to 100psi.

I will be using stans in future.

Had the same experiance.  On paper it sounds like it should be great but in practice the liquid bit just doesnt seem to want to "cure" properly and make the seal.  Maybe they had to make it thinner to carry the carbon fibre without turning to porridge, I don't know.  Whatever it is, it doesnt work.

My initial experience was similar, with lots of leakage around the bead and overnight deflation, but once I'd gone out for a couple of 25mile + rides it all sealed up nicely, and retains pressure as well as the tyres I've used Doc Blue on.

I've yet to have a puncture tho, so have no idea of the level of performance there. I may top up that pair of tyres to make up for the initial losses.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #877 on: November 16, 2018, 10:44:55 am »
i haven't had this problem yet, but it can happen:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYBM-WCAcsE

jiberjaber

  • ... Fancy Pants \o/ ...
  • ACME S&M^2
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #878 on: November 16, 2018, 11:13:49 am »
i haven't had this problem yet, but it can happen:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYBM-WCAcsE

Oh FFS - that was painful to watch, he even said he was going to ignore the thing that would have got him back in the game (soapy water!) and failed to adequately clean the tyre/rim.  It wasn't a failure of tubeless - it was a failure of his workflow, the time wasted was of his own making unfortunately!

Good bits from the video was showing how easy it was to remove the tyre with his hands.
Regards,

Joergen

simonp

  • Omnomnomnipotent.
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #879 on: November 16, 2018, 11:15:50 am »
I said I'd only go tubeless when Continental joined in.

Now they have, I have to make a decision.

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #880 on: November 16, 2018, 02:12:24 pm »


Good bits from the video was showing how easy it was to remove the tyre with his hands.

everyone who used tubeless knows it's easy, or at least no harder than tubed tyres..
come to think of it i hardly ever use tyre levers on any wheels i own

fd3

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #881 on: November 16, 2018, 06:23:01 pm »
Specific question (probably for mike) what size valves do I need?  I have Kinlin XR22Ts.  Should it be depth (~22mm) + a couple cm?  (I'm guessing 55mm would do as that gives me enough space for pump and knuts to hold it in place).

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #882 on: November 16, 2018, 08:46:53 pm »
Specific question (probably for mike) what size valves do I need?  I have Kinlin XR22Ts.  Should it be depth (~22mm) + a couple cm?  (I'm guessing 55mm would do as that gives me enough space for pump and knuts to hold it in place).

55mm will be plenty. 40mm would probably be fine, but shorter might make inflating tyres difficult, depending on how well and where your pump seals against the valve stem. I’ve got a pair of valves on one set of rims that are a bit too short and tbh there a pain, but the tyres don’t lose air very quickly and I haven’t yet bothered to swap them out.

fd3

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #883 on: November 16, 2018, 09:39:51 pm »
Thanks!  I thought I would err on the side of longer as the valves on my tubes only just poke out far enough for the pump.

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #884 on: January 30, 2019, 10:22:16 am »
M'colleague asked for my advice this morning...

She bought a new commuting bike fitted with tubeless tyres in October and has got on well with them so far, but this morning she found her rear tyre had gone flat overnight. She pumped it up and rode to work but it is losing air pressure.

I said it sounds like it could just need topping up with fresh sealant (which is what I did to successfully cure similar symptoms) but does anyone have any thoughts on other potential causes and solutions?

She also asked how she goes about topping up the sealant... I tried to explain but could see her eyes glazing over. Maybe it would be easier to just do it for her.

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #885 on: January 30, 2019, 04:57:06 pm »
When cleaning the lanefilth from the Mason after last weekend's wet 200, I found a couple of substantial flints embedded in the tread of the rear tyre*.  There's been no loss of pressure, nor any sign of sealant around the cuts.

What does the panel think:  Should I remove the flints or leave them there?

* Hutchinson Fusion5 All Season in 28-622.  Impressively grippy and has shrugged off half a dozen winter 200s so far

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #886 on: January 30, 2019, 06:04:43 pm »
Id say pull it out, see if it seals, and if not put a tubeless patch on the inside of the tyre.

Better to do this at home, at your convenience, in the warm and dry...

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #887 on: January 30, 2019, 06:26:25 pm »
Better to do this at home, at your convenience, in the warm and dry...

...and with a spare tyre to hand.

Thanks.  I'll give it a go

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #888 on: January 30, 2019, 06:50:45 pm »
If you are a real tightarse you can even suck the sealant into a syringe and reuse it when you remount the patched tyre. ;D

You won't need a spare tyre, I suspect. Patching works well IME.

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #889 on: February 11, 2019, 02:31:26 pm »
To get back on track. I was seduced by the claims of finish line Kevlar sealant. I put it into two new tyres on rims that were designed for tubeless. The rear tyre has stayed up but the front has deflated on 5 successive days despite in excess of 100km and multiple re inflations to 100psi.

I will be using stans in future.

Had the same experiance.  On paper it sounds like it should be great but in practice the liquid bit just doesnt seem to want to "cure" properly and make the seal.  Maybe they had to make it thinner to carry the carbon fibre without turning to porridge, I don't know.  Whatever it is, it doesnt work.

My initial experience was similar, with lots of leakage around the bead and overnight deflation, but once I'd gone out for a couple of 25mile + rides it all sealed up nicely, and retains pressure as well as the tyres I've used Doc Blue on.

I've yet to have a puncture tho, so have no idea of the level of performance there. I may top up that pair of tyres to make up for the initial losses.

Well an update. Left to their own devices (ie in the shed untouched) the tyres with Finish Line in continue to deflate, one at an almost acceptable rate, the other most definitely not, with leakage around the rim as evidenced by escaping moisture. It might be a tyre bead issue, as the rims were previously used successfully with a different tyre.

Anyway, after some thought, I've decided to revert to latex (or in my case pseudo latex Caffelatex) sealant. And I'm switching tyres to Fusion 5 All Seasons.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #890 on: February 11, 2019, 02:51:28 pm »


Has anyone tried flying with tubeless tyres? Any issues to be be aware of?

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Zed43

  • prefers UK hills over Dutch mountains
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #891 on: February 11, 2019, 03:00:39 pm »
Has anyone tried flying with tubeless tyres? Any issues to be be aware of?
Unless you get a hand inspection by someone who insists you should completely deflate your tyres you're fine. (I always let a little air out so I can declare in all honesty that yes, I did deflate my tyres  ;D) If you deflate the tyre to the point that the bead comes loose from the lip of the rim you're SOL unless you bring a compressor.

jiberjaber

  • ... Fancy Pants \o/ ...
  • ACME S&M^2
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #892 on: February 11, 2019, 03:33:29 pm »


Has anyone tried flying with tubeless tyres? Any issues to be be aware of?

J

I flew at Xmas without problems, just dropped them down to 30psi or so.  I pontificated over what to do but the general google results showed the cargo to be pressureised for circa 10,000ft and designed to be habitable by animals, so its not a huge pressure change in real terms.... if the hold depressureises, there's more to worry about than sealant all over the inside of a bike box IMHO.
Regards,

Joergen

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #893 on: February 12, 2019, 12:21:20 pm »

Cheers. Am trying to work out what to run on the TCR (and how to get there)

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

fuaran

  • rothair gasta
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #894 on: February 12, 2019, 12:53:41 pm »
Even if the hold is completely depressurised, it's still only a change of about 1 bar/ 15 psi. So it won't make much difference to your tyres.

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #895 on: February 12, 2019, 01:07:37 pm »
The hold is the same pressure vessel as the cabin - ther cabin floor is not airtight - so if the hold depressurises you have bigger things to worry about as you lose consciousness and glide gently into the ocean.

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #896 on: February 13, 2019, 01:38:34 pm »
To get back on track. I was seduced by the claims of finish line Kevlar sealant. I put it into two new tyres on rims that were designed for tubeless. The rear tyre has stayed up but the front has deflated on 5 successive days despite in excess of 100km and multiple re inflations to 100psi.

I will be using stans in future.

Had the same experiance.  On paper it sounds like it should be great but in practice the liquid bit just doesnt seem to want to "cure" properly and make the seal.  Maybe they had to make it thinner to carry the carbon fibre without turning to porridge, I don't know.  Whatever it is, it doesnt work.

My initial experience was similar, with lots of leakage around the bead and overnight deflation, but once I'd gone out for a couple of 25mile + rides it all sealed up nicely, and retains pressure as well as the tyres I've used Doc Blue on.

I've yet to have a puncture tho, so have no idea of the level of performance there. I may top up that pair of tyres to make up for the initial losses.

Well an update. Left to their own devices (ie in the shed untouched) the tyres with Finish Line in continue to deflate, one at an almost acceptable rate, the other most definitely not, with leakage around the rim as evidenced by escaping moisture. It might be a tyre bead issue, as the rims were previously used successfully with a different tyre.

Anyway, after some thought, I've decided to revert to latex (or in my case pseudo latex Caffelatex) sealant. And I'm switching tyres to Fusion 5 All Seasons.

I've had some finishline in my MTB tyres for a few months. They have finally stopped weeping - but does that mean they are sealed or does it mean that the juice has all dried up....?

Anyway, been using Caffelatex on my other bikes now and am quite happy with it. I say that, but i don't actually know if it's saved my bacon at all yet.

Ben T

  • What you saying, then?
Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #897 on: February 13, 2019, 02:33:35 pm »


Has anyone tried flying with tubeless tyres? Any issues to be be aware of?

J

Even if it completely depressurises it will only make a difference of about 25%.
The relative pressure difference between tyres (70 psi = ~5bar) and atmosphere (~1bar) is ~4 bar.
If the atmosphere drops to 0, it is a difference of ~5bar, instead of 4, which is still only like having the tyres inflated to 87 psi on the ground, which they can easily handle.
I do find that slightly bizarre, I must admit.

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #898 on: February 13, 2019, 05:38:21 pm »
This is good guide to flying and covers what has been discussed here: https://www.cyclinguk.org/cyclists-library/bikes-public-transport/bikes-air

On a different topic, got an old wheel out yesterday, and could not get the tyre off on one side (S-One + Pancenti SL23), try as hard as I could - ended up cutting it off as was a worn out tyre, but is there a trick to unseating recalcitrant beads? Felt like the sealant had effectively glued it to the rim.
“That slope may look insignificant, but it's going to be my destiny" - Fitzcarraldo

Re: Tubeless for Dummies
« Reply #899 on: February 13, 2019, 05:42:58 pm »
Yes, I had to resort to using a bench vice. It worked (using leverage) but I was worried about what would have happened if I had a failure out on the road that couldn't be fixed by a worm.

It seemed to be just that rim / tyre combo and I've swapped rims since. They were WTB ST rims with WTB Horizon tyres.

I now have WTB KOM rims and WTB Horizon tyres (all new) and I haven't had a problem.