Author Topic: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...  (Read 7961 times)

Riggers

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #50 on: September 03, 2015, 09:42:14 am »
Looked like they were going through hell yesterday. ITV4 seems to have re-appeared back on our TV (channel 801), so able to watch the highlights. Wouldn't it be nice to attempt (some) of those roads, and WITHOUT traffic too.

Wonder how Froome managed to crash?
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

Dibdib

  • Fat'n'slow
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2015, 09:55:37 am »
Wonder how Froome managed to crash?

Knocked sideways into the roadside barriers, according to his twitter.

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2015, 10:13:12 am »
It isn't *necessary* to have a camera moto (or support moto) in such close proximity. They always have the option of dropping back etc.
Their prime directive is 'first do no harm'. I think we are starting to see more and closer TV, and a new generation of moto pilots who do not have the experience (and directors pushing for ever closer footage) leading to more incidents.
Yet (as you well know!) riders will crash without any cameras or motorbikes (e.g. closed circuits).

Surely the riders have an equally prime directive of "finish the stage/race" - yet many fail in this through their own fault (or that of other riders). They also always have the option of dropping back.

Has never ridden RAAM
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No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2015, 10:15:59 am »
Dave, I know it gets joked about a lot but have you any idea what he is doing when he keeps looking down?  Is it a wattage read out or just a Paula Radcliffe-type thing?  Whatever it is, it must be a bad thing to be coninually taking your eye "off the ball" like that.

If you hunt around you should find the relevant interviews; Froome has said that he is just more comfortable with his head down. There may be old footage out there of Froome riding before he could afford a power-meter!

(Noone seems to have investigated whether he has an underlying spinal/health condition, or similar).
Has never ridden RAAM
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No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

fuzzy (retd.) AAGE

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #54 on: September 03, 2015, 10:17:06 am »
It isn't *necessary* to have a camera moto (or support moto) in such close proximity. They always have the option of dropping back etc.
Their prime directive is 'first do no harm'. I think we are starting to see more and closer TV, and a new generation of moto pilots who do not have the experience (and directors pushing for ever closer footage) leading to more incidents.
Yet (as you well know!) riders will crash without any cameras or motorbikes (e.g. closed circuits).

Surely the riders have an equally prime directive of "finish the stage/race" - yet many fail in this through their own fault (or that of other riders). They also always have the option of dropping back.

Racers dropping back shouldn't be the solution though. The race is about, well, racers racing y'know? Camera dudes on camera bikes are there to capture the grace (or otherwise), beauty (or otherwise) and excitement (or total boredom) of the race in question. They should be doing it without affecting the racers. A camera biker and camera dude should work on the same principal as doctors- 'first, do no harm.....'
Quote from: tatanab
The mark of a true cyclist - prepared to try anything on offer

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David Martin

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #55 on: September 03, 2015, 10:56:33 am »
Wot fuzzy said...
There seems to be a directive to use wide angle shots on the motor as these give a more dramatic image but do mean you have to be closer.

Race Director should put an exclusion zone of 10m in front and 5m behind any rider unless the moto is rendering direct authorised assistance.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #57 on: September 03, 2015, 11:42:04 am »
Oleg Tinkof has apologized to Chris Froome for saying he rode 'like a girl' yesterday. As far as I know, he hasn't apologized to girls yet.

Dibdib

  • Fat'n'slow
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #58 on: September 03, 2015, 12:13:10 pm »
Oleg Tinkof has apologized to Chris Froome for saying he rode 'like a girl' yesterday. As far as I know, he hasn't apologized to girls yet.

I thought he doubled down and pontificated that girls shouldn't race at all?

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #59 on: September 03, 2015, 12:30:02 pm »
It isn't *necessary* to have a camera moto (or support moto) in such close proximity. They always have the option of dropping back etc.
Their prime directive is 'first do no harm'. I think we are starting to see more and closer TV, and a new generation of moto pilots who do not have the experience (and directors pushing for ever closer footage) leading to more incidents.
Yet (as you well know!) riders will crash without any cameras or motorbikes (e.g. closed circuits).

Surely the riders have an equally prime directive of "finish the stage/race" - yet many fail in this through their own fault (or that of other riders). They also always have the option of dropping back.

Racers dropping back shouldn't be the solution though.
I think you've misunderstood me: I meant that most crashes between RIDERS could be avoided by the riders dropping back i.e. not riding dangerously close to each-other.

Of course  that would totally change the nature of bunch racing. But it would be safer; in fact, it would be safer than the current setup, despite the occasional horrendous misjudgement by a moto-rider.

(I'm not saying that the motons' driving can't be improved - but its a fact that their presence is an integral part of professional televised racing. )
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #60 on: September 03, 2015, 01:00:37 pm »
But Quintana isn't liekly to be drawing his pension any time soon..They are both eligible for the young rider category.

There isn't a young rider category at the Vuelta.

Quintana was eligible for the young rider category at the Tour by a matter of a month or so. Chaves would have been eligible by a matter of a few days had he ridden the Tour. (The cutoff date for the Tour this year was on or after 1st January 1990, Chaves was born on 17 Jan 1990, Quintana on 4 Feb 1990.)

I don't know how the Giro define young riders - I know it used to be different to the Tour but it might be the same now. Chaves was defined as a young rider at this year's Giro though.

Neither will be a young rider next season.

fuzzy (retd.) AAGE

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #61 on: September 03, 2015, 01:44:28 pm »
It isn't *necessary* to have a camera moto (or support moto) in such close proximity. They always have the option of dropping back etc.
Their prime directive is 'first do no harm'. I think we are starting to see more and closer TV, and a new generation of moto pilots who do not have the experience (and directors pushing for ever closer footage) leading to more incidents.
Yet (as you well know!) riders will crash without any cameras or motorbikes (e.g. closed circuits).

Surely the riders have an equally prime directive of "finish the stage/race" - yet many fail in this through their own fault (or that of other riders). They also always have the option of dropping back.

Racers dropping back shouldn't be the solution though.
I think you've misunderstood me: I meant that most crashes between RIDERS could be avoided by the riders dropping back i.e. not riding dangerously close to each-other.

Of course  that would totally change the nature of bunch racing. But it would be safer; in fact, it would be safer than the current setup, despite the occasional horrendous misjudgement by a moto-rider.

(I'm not saying that the motons' driving can't be improved - but its a fact that their presence is an integral part of professional televised racing. )

Yes, I did misunderstand- sorry.

re riders spacing themselves out more though, you have hit the nail on the head. Bunch racing involves, if not requires close wheeling in order to gain the best advantage from the slipstream etc. Riders crashing due to their proximity to each other when something happens is part of the game. Incidents initiated by motorbikes of any flavour and cars of a similar vein shouldn't occur.
Quote from: tatanab
The mark of a true cyclist - prepared to try anything on offer

If it ain't bad for you it ain't worth doing

Dibdib

  • Fat'n'slow
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #62 on: September 03, 2015, 02:21:56 pm »
Before the TV companies get all the stick, how many of these crashes are due to TV motos rather than local press, commissaires, bidon bikes, neutral service (*cough*shimano*cough*), etc...?

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #63 on: September 03, 2015, 02:55:44 pm »
Thats a good question Dibdib - I'm pretty sure that the infamous Hoogerland/barbed-wire incident was basically a VIP jolly.



favourite snippet from yesterday's monster stage: Chaves admitting to doing a recon ride .. over 2 days!  :D
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #64 on: September 03, 2015, 02:58:31 pm »
Although I read that both the recent Astana upsets were TVE moto's.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #65 on: September 03, 2015, 11:42:29 pm »
Although I read that both the recent Astana upsets were TVE moto's.
Astana? Tinkov-Saxo. One was a neutral service, one was TVE.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Riggers

  • Mine's a pipe, er… pint!
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #66 on: September 08, 2015, 11:36:02 am »
Never mind about all of that chaps. What about that stage finish yesterday!! How steep!? 21.67% to be precise at some point it was. I'd need all the drugs on offer to get up those hills!! Well done Frank Schhhhhleck!
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #67 on: September 08, 2015, 12:22:30 pm »
I didnt know Frank was still riding, let alone in this Vuelta!

It's been a great race. Domoulin actually looks like he might pull this off.
(click to show/hide)
He's an easy chap to like. If Chavez can't win this thing, I hope Tom does!

(Can anyone get excited about TofB while this race is still going? )
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #68 on: September 08, 2015, 12:30:55 pm »

(Can anyone get excited about TofB while this race is still going? )

In a word no! To be honest the ToB is still only a cat 2 race or whatever they call it so apart from some local interest and scenery I might recognise It's not really one I would go out of my way to watch. Mrs trekker tolerates my TV cycling obsession but one hour of highlights tends to be enough for both of us - in fact she was cheering Tom on last night up the steep bits.

A shame really, I'm supposed to follow our home race but just can't get excited about it. Not helped by the fact it finishes in Ipswich on Saturday (where we live) but we have to drive to Milton Keynes for a wedding!

Anyway, looking forward to the time trial tomorrow

Go Tom!
Duct tape is magic and should be worshipped

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #69 on: September 09, 2015, 11:44:36 am »
Oleg Tinkof has apologized to Chris Froome for saying he rode 'like a girl' yesterday. As far as I know, he hasn't apologized to girls yet.

I thought he doubled down and pontificated that girls shouldn't race at all?
Has anyone ever seen Oleg Tinkov and Donald Trump in the same room together?

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #70 on: September 09, 2015, 12:08:05 pm »
Oleg Tinkof has apologized to Chris Froome for saying he rode 'like a girl' yesterday. As far as I know, he hasn't apologized to girls yet.

I thought he doubled down and pontificated that girls shouldn't race at all?
Has anyone ever seen Oleg Tinkov and Donald Trump in the same room together?

No, because there is not enough room for both of their egos at the same time.  :demon:
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And when you look long into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you." ~ Friedrich Nietzsche

Riggers

  • Mine's a pipe, er… pint!
Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #71 on: September 10, 2015, 09:43:40 am »
It's Dumoulin Rouge!
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

Karla

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #72 on: September 10, 2015, 10:25:52 am »
Next year's Giro has 3 TT stages.  If Dumoulin wins, you heard it here first.

Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #73 on: September 10, 2015, 12:18:24 pm »
Never mind about all of that chaps. What about that stage finish yesterday!! How steep!? 21.67% to be precise at some point it was. I'd need all the drugs on offer to get up those hills!! Well done Frank Schhhhhleck!

Just watched the highlights - really steep, that road kept getting narrower and uber steep right to the end.  Having just done Streatley Hill for the first(!) time (at an in the saddle slug-like pace, well OK, ~6mins) I felt I was relating to their pain a bit more than I usually do...
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

mattc

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Re: TdF has cobbles, Giro has Strada Bianchi, Vuelta has...
« Reply #74 on: September 10, 2015, 01:01:04 pm »
It's Dumoulin Rouge!
We need a feeble handclap smiley. This one isn't really appropriate here:  :thumbsup:
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles