Stealth cyclists - Deliveroo dressed in black at night

[drossall]

Some of the new reversible jackets and gilets are pretty impressive at night. You wear the hi-vis reflective side out in daytime and the reflective at night - the latter makes you stand out amazingly. But only as long as there aren't too many around, as above - high visibility means high compared to everyone else.

[Cudzoziemiec]

There seems to have been a trend over the last few years to increase the amount of reflectives on jackets relative to the fluorescent. Presumably a reaction to the market success of the Proviz (was that the brand?) 360 reflectives.

A couple of years back I almost rode into a police horse. I only noticed them by the green power LED on their radio. They were in the dark, and above the angle of my Stvzo light, so it didn't out any reflectives, and the fluorescent bits did nothing as it was night.

J

That's one of the drawbacks of StVZO and similar headlights with a sharp horizontal cut off. Also a reason to put reflectives low down; UK police horses have some stuff on their shins*, modern cars seem to have reflectors in their bumpers rather than light clusters and of course pedal reflectors. And finally, you obviously weren't riding at a speed to stop in the distance you could see to be clear!

*Or whatever you call that part of a horse's leg.

[rogerzilla]

*Or whatever you call that part of a horse's leg.

Le tasty bit

[Cudzoziemiec]

*Or whatever you call that part of a horse's leg.

Le tasty bit

Gives Roger a withering look.



And then a good fetlocking, because that's what Roger likes.

[rogerzilla]

I thought that one up on the hoof.

[Cudzoziemiec]

You need to be kept on a tight rein.

[Kim]

Often it's not the size of the light, or the brightness. But the movement.

I think the leg movement is a big part of why I seem to get fewer SMIDSYs on a recumbent.  Not so much at night, though, as it's becomes just another set of bike lights.

[Kim]

Anything that makes you noticed may help, without making you more visible, because it grabs attention - unusual clothing, erratic riding (which has obvious risks from other perspectives), etc

I've previously described following a BSOist up a hill: They had a helmet, clipped through the elastic cord on the outside of their rucksack.  It was bouncing around spectacularly, and gaining them the sort of room from passing motorists that you normally need a recumbent tricycle to achieve.

[JellyLegs]

I am pretty convinced movement is the key to both being visible and being visibly human.  I definitely seem to get given more room when I use a combination of lights / reflectives that move relative to each other when compared to the times I use more lights but without the movement.  The most effective seems to be a lit or a reflective ankle band.  I have pedal reflectors but am unconvinced they are all that visible from the rear, the ankle band is definitely highly visible though.

[Kim]

I find the motion of pedal reflectors very noticeable^[1], but possibly in the same way that Rohloff hubs are noticeable: I'm paying attention to that sort of thing because I'm a cyclist, and I have little faith that the average motorist would clock them.


_{[1] Assuming they aren't drowned out by proper bike lights.  It's usually the unlit BSOs that you spot by the pedal reflectors, after all.}

[Cudzoziemiec]

The same with front reflectors. They're excellent for spotting unlit cyclists way off in the distance on the rly pths. But I guess if they were really useful, they'd be required on dogs.

[quixoticgeek]

The same with front reflectors. They're excellent for spotting unlit cyclists way off in the distance on the rly pths. But I guess if they were really useful, they'd be required on dogs.

Something I find infuriating here is the number of dog owners who will attach an LED collar to the dog. They often put an illuminy arm band in their arm.

But do nothing about the invisible black garotte that goes from owners hand to dog, across the bike path.

You just have to know when you see a dog, look for an owner, and know that death and/or pain lays between the two. And try to go round the back of the owner.

J

[Kim]

Apropos of nothing in particular, I saw the electric unicycle ninja on the A38 cycleway just now.  He was concealed among a cluster of cyclists who were waiting for me to trigger the ballet school traffic lights (which seem to be forever in need of adjustment) from the side with the working sensor.

[Mr Larrington]

My chum Evil Frank has one o' them.  B'ain't be natural, so it ent!

[Cudzoziemiec]

The same with front reflectors. They're excellent for spotting unlit cyclists way off in the distance on the rly pths. But I guess if they were really useful, they'd be required on dogs.

Something I find infuriating here is the number of dog owners who will attach an LED collar to the dog. They often put an illuminy arm band in their arm.

But do nothing about the invisible black garotte that goes from owners hand to dog, across the bike path.

You just have to know when you see a dog, look for an owner, and know that death and/or pain lays between the two. And try to go round the back of the owner.

J

A few weeks ago I was walking a dog. Friend of a friend's dog, so friend of a friend's dog lead and yes it was one of those long thin black expanding ones. On one occasion another dog walker told me how they distrusted those expanding leads because apparently their friend/brother/mother-in-law had lost a finger to one. So they're lethal to both cyclists and dog walkers.

[The Family Cyclist]

We've touched on this in other threads but extendable leads are EVIL, genuinely banned in the adoption agreement for our greyhound and that's just for owner/hound safety and behaviour not even considering the hazard to cyclists/other path users

[Cudzoziemiec]

What's the danger to the dog? Presumably that the human has the illusion of control* but in fact the dog could dash out into traffic or whatever – but maybe there's something else?

*And the dog the illusion of freedom.

[The Family Cyclist]

In the case of a greyhound it can get to pushing 40mph in the length of the lead and will then stop very suddenly, worse if its only got a neck collar. It also encourages bad behaviour as they need to pull on the lead and yes if the locking on lead fails said dog can run into road/upto another dog who doesn't appreciate the company

[ElyDave]

I am pretty convinced movement is the key to both being visible and being visibly human.  I definitely seem to get given more room when I use a combination of lights / reflectives that move relative to each other when compared to the times I use more lights but without the movement.  The most effective seems to be a lit or a reflective ankle band.  I have pedal reflectors but am unconvinced they are all that visible from the rear, the ankle band is definitely highly visible though.

I need to get myself one of those ankle bands, gave my last one to No 1 daughter. 

I did my first winter cycle commute to our Cambridge office yesterday (home-Station, station-office) and was very impressed by the B&M Luxos in the utter dark of TEH FENZ once i'd left Ely homewards, having not used it other than in general murk and overcast before now. 

[perpetual dan]

The same with front reflectors. They're excellent for spotting unlit cyclists way off in the distance on the rly pths. But I guess if they were really useful, they'd be required on dogs.

Something I find infuriating here is the number of dog owners who will attach an LED collar to the dog. They often put an illuminy arm band in their arm.
….

There was a dog with two red LEDs on its collar in the fog in Monday night. The owner was dark and a bit indistinct, but looked like they were walking a hell hound. A well behaved one, on a safe lead, though.

[rogerzilla]

Those LED collars make me think of The Running Man.

[Solocle]

I am pretty convinced movement is the key to both being visible and being visibly human.  I definitely seem to get given more room when I use a combination of lights / reflectives that move relative to each other when compared to the times I use more lights but without the movement.  The most effective seems to be a lit or a reflective ankle band.  I have pedal reflectors but am unconvinced they are all that visible from the rear, the ankle band is definitely highly visible though.

I need to get myself one of those ankle bands, gave my last one to No 1 daughter. 

I did my first winter cycle commute to our Cambridge office yesterday (home-Station, station-office) and was very impressed by the B&M Luxos in the utter dark of TEH FENZ once i'd left Ely homewards, having not used it other than in general murk and overcast before now.

I do appreciate my SON Edelux with B&M Topline. But I prefer to also have a flashing light at the rear (Cycliq Fly 6 here, I now have a Varia RCT 715, with the Cycliq as a spare).

[mzjo]

I feel compelled to react. Extensible dog leads are not just extensible, they are also, more importantly, retractable! Dogs around obstacles (including other dogs, humans and bicycles on shared paths) should be on a short lead. I have a dog, frequently these days have a second on extended visit and I walk both at the same time with retractable leads. I also carry poo bags (and use them where appropriate, although I don't hunt dog poo in the brambles and nettles at night!). I keep them (dogs, not turds!) on a short lead when we meet people with or without dogs, bicycles, "trottinettes", electric or otherwise, pushchairs, deliveroo bags etc. I feel deeply aggreaved by dog owners that don't respect sensible practices around other people or dogs (one of our neighbours, who also happens to be an ex-colleague of my wife was actually attacked by another dog while walking hers on one of the paths that I regularly use; Inexcusable!)
 I would also feel deeply aggreaved if a cyclist came at me from behind without warning on a shared path and expected me to suddenly disappear (but then the shared paths I use are pavements first and the law is quite clear that pedestrians have priority). This does not happen very often, perhaps the consequence of living in a part of the world with space for people. (Incidentally hte same co-operation is the norm in this part of the world when encountering mtbs on the trails in the woods, there aren't too many idiots around - or they're all riding souped-up scooters and mopeds around the tower blocks!)

On moving passive aids: I don't like wheel reflectors because I have a fear of things stuck in my spokes - but for being seen side on at night (like on a roundabout) they really do work - and they flash really well, provided that there are only one or at most two per wheel, more than that and they become continuous rather than flashing. For the price, (3-4€ per bike) fit and forget (until they fall off!)

[Asterix, the former Gaul.]

Excessively bright bike lights are a real PITA on cycle tracks. Riding on a shared pavement track I thought an oncoming cyclist’s light was from a car across the road, as it completely dazzled me. All I could see was the sodding light. No chance of seeing any pedestrians behind it.

(Yes, I had my eyes tested 2 weeks ago and am fine driving at night when I can see unlit cyclists pretty easily by the silhouette or reflections on things like pedal cranks)

[Kim]

Apropos of nothing in particular, I saw the electric unicycle ninja on the A38 cycleway just now.  He was concealed among a cluster of cyclists who were waiting for me to trigger the ballet school traffic lights (which seem to be forever in need of adjustment) from the side with the working sensor.

I got an Ogmios-compliant wave of acknowledgement from the unicycle ninja yesterday.  Also, someone seems to have fixed the traffic lights.  Must be karma.