Coffee machine recommends please.

[nobby]

I want a coffee machine that makes lattes and use beans I have ground.
Which are the good ones, please?

[Hot Flatus]

That doesn't give us much to go on.  Start with a budget

[nobby]

Budget less than £400.

[ElyDave]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

[Hot Flatus]

^ fwap fwap

[Feanor]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

Yes, same here.

But I will somewhat grudgingly admit that the coffee provided by Maveric OTP when I did disturb him at late-o'clock when I was 300k into a 400 with a mechanical, was really good. Much moar betterer than mine. Thanks again...

[CAMRAMan]

My Gaggia Classic has served me well, but I was somewhat surprised to see they're now over £400. I paid just over half that 7 years ago.

[Hot Flatus]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

Yes, same here.

But I will somewhat grudgingly admit that the coffee provided by Maveric OTP when I did disturb him at late-o'clock when I was 300k into a 400 with a mechanical, was really good. Much moar betterer than mine. Thanks again...

I think he had my old Rancilio Silvia off me about 11 years ago.

[Hot Flatus]

Talking of which...its probably still the best machine at that price point, especially because there are possibilities for relatively easy modding (eg PID)

[Robh]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

Same here. And everyone who has ever drank a cup from it has commented favourably on the quality - but I put that down to the beans (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00QIUHQQM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

[nobby]

Thanks all.

[T42]

I want a coffee machine that makes lattes and use beans I have ground.
Which are the good ones, please?

Question: do you want an espresso machine with its hefty learning-curve or just to bung coffee into a machine and get a latte out of it?  If the former, good luck to you, and if the latter, the only machine I've ever come across that delivered half-decent lattes straight out of the spout was in an Ibis hotel and probably cost a mint, but there are decent B2C machines out there for under £400.  You'll have to steam the milk yourself but there'll be a spout for that. The grinder will make an aficionado's lip curl but will probably be adequate, and if you prefer your own grind there'll be a trap to bung it in by.  You'll have to do a bit of dialling-in but once it's set up the results will be consistent as long as you use recently-roasted beans don't chop & change variety all the time.  Conventional wisdom is that you'll never get a stupendous shot but they'll always be good, which I've found to be true.

[citoyen]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

Surely the snobs will say if you’re using it to make latte, it doesn’t matter if the coffee is shit anyway?

[Ham]

Talking of which...its probably still the best machine at that price point, especially because there are possibilities for relatively easy modding (eg PID)

I'm dead 'appy with mine (with PID), I can see that more money might provide more consistency and better plumbing, but I'm not tempted in the slightest.

[Hot Flatus]

Talking of which...its probably still the best machine at that price point, especially because there are possibilities for relatively easy modding (eg PID)

I'm dead 'appy with mine (with PID), I can see that more money might provide more consistency and better plumbing, but I'm not tempted in the slightest.

A little research and I see that Rancilio now offer the Silvia as a PID option...although they charge quite a whack for it.

I couldn't go back to one in all honesty, in fact I couldn't go back to any of my previous machines or grinders because the current kit just makes it so easy to smash out really good shots and milk every time. Takes me two to three goes to dial in new beans, then the merest tweakage of the grind as the beans age and I'm all good. Taste and eye does it, no need for me to follow weight and ratio recipes because I'm not using challenging beans. The huge Mazzer Major grinder is the only one that has never resulted in channelling. I did have an enormous and very complicated Eureka 75mm burred thing once but I got rid of it after a month or so because the coffee just tasted flat. Weird how a grinder can do that.

The biggest issue for me on the Rancilio (once PID'd) would be the steam power for milk. In fact my previous machine (a nice chrome steel E61 dual boiler beast) didn't have the required steam power for perfect flat whites.

Like I say, you can go forward. But you can't go back.

[De Sisti]

You can learn something new everyday.  I didn't know what a PID was.


PID stands for Proportional Integral Derivative. Although the name sounds very sophisticated, it’s pretty much a temperature controller integrated into an espresso machine.

A PID controller uses an advanced algorithm to regulate the temperature so that it stays exactly at the degree you need to make the perfect cup of coffee. Any true coffee enthusiast will tell you that the water temperature needs to be between 195-205 degrees Fahrenheit.

[Hot Flatus]

Essentially it pulses the power in to keep it pretty constant, unlike a thermostat which switches on and off with a resulting large range of temperatures. Some older machines get around this by using a thermosiphon, but they require a cooling flush before pulling the shot.

[rafletcher]

You can learn something new everyday.  I didn't know what a PID was.


PID stands for Proportional Integral Derivative. Although the name sounds very sophisticated, it’s pretty much a temperature controller integrated into an espresso machine.

A PID controller uses an advanced algorithm to regulate the temperature so that it stays exactly at the degree you need to make the perfect cup of coffee. Any true coffee enthusiast will tell you that the water temperature needs to be between 195-205 degrees Fahrenheit.

PID is a feedback control loop, and is far from unique to coffee machines. For example we use such control to keep the temperature of out CT system enclosures constant, so the samples don't change size during the hours-long scans.

[Ham]

The biggest issue for me on the Rancilio (once PID'd) would be the steam power for milk. In fact my previous machine (a nice chrome steel E61 dual boiler beast) didn't have the required steam power for perfect flat whites.

I'd agree with that on the one or two occasions I've tried creating milky drinks for victims guests its shortcomings (and mine) were evident, my own taste doesn't include milk in anything so I'm 'appy.

[Hot Flatus]

Good 

It's an excellent espresso machine once you've ironed out the temp fluctuations with a PID. Simple really old design, but it works and has a hefty brewgroup.

The other ballache with milk is having to switch it to steam  temp, and wait for it to heat up....after pulling the shot.

[Hot Flatus]

You can learn something new everyday.  I didn't know what a PID was.


PID stands for Proportional Integral Derivative. Although the name sounds very sophisticated, it’s pretty much a temperature controller integrated into an espresso machine.

A PID controller uses an advanced algorithm to regulate the temperature so that it stays exactly at the degree you need to make the perfect cup of coffee. Any true coffee enthusiast will tell you that the water temperature needs to be between 195-205 degrees Fahrenheit.

PID is a feedback control loop, and is far from unique to coffee machines. For example we use such control to keep the temperature of out CT system enclosures constant, so the samples don't change size during the hours-long scans.

IIRC the PID I fitted to my Rancilio (which as far as I can recall went to Maverick) came from an industrial oven in a bakery

An awful lot of decent espresso machines* have them now

*broadly speaking £1k+

[Maverick]

I've been very pleased with my Sage machine, but not going to reccomend it as some snob will be along in 5 minutes to tell me why it's shit

Yes, same here.

But I will somewhat grudgingly admit that the coffee provided by Maveric OTP when I did disturb him at late-o'clock when I was 300k into a 400 with a mechanical, was really good. Much moar betterer than mine. Thanks again...

I think he had my old Rancilio Silvia off me about 11 years ago.

Just come accross this thread. Feanor - you were welcome, glad you got home ok. HF - I purchased a new Rancilio Silvia in 2011 (and almost immediately modded it with a PID), I thought you sold your old one to Charlotte? You provided some great advice on buying good coffee.  It is still going strong, spares are still easily available - dispersion screens, gaskets and baskets have been regular replacements - I would only recommend a version with a PID. I am tempted to upgrade to the new Silvia Pro X and it will probably happen in 2023. My original will then be passed on to my son. He inherited my 11 year old Rancilio grinder when I upgraded to a Niche this year. I would highly recommend the Niche it has made a huge improvement to my espresso. Feanor - drop by when you a passing to taste the improved espresso.

[andyoxon]

Coffee machine engineers at work..?
'OK what shall we call this temperature controller thing?'
'How about a Proportional Integral Derivative...'   
'Please pass the TAL'
'The what?'
'The Thermal Assessment Lance'
'Eh?'
'Sorry, thermometer'...

[Hot Flatus]

I think he had my old Rancilio Silvia off me about 11 years ago.

Just come accross this thread. Feanor - you were welcome, glad you got home ok. HF - I purchased a new Rancilio Silvia in 2011 (and almost immediately modded it with a PID), I thought you sold your old one to Charlotte? You provided some great advice on buying good coffee.  It is still going strong, spares are still easily available - dispersion screens, gaskets and baskets have been regular replacements - I would only recommend a version with a PID. I am tempted to upgrade to the new Silvia Pro X and it will probably happen in 2023. My original will then be passed on to my son. He inherited my 11 year old Rancilio grinder when I upgraded to a Niche this year. I would highly recommend the Niche it has made a huge improvement to my espresso. Feanor - drop by when you a passing to taste the improved espresso.

 

Honestly I can't remember who had it. I think it might have been another forummer whose face I can picture but I cant remember his name (Andy somebody)

Very glad yours is going strong, and interested to hear about your Niche. They are very well reviewed and have quite a small footprint.  It's amazing the difference grinders make, and I was cynical too jntil I changed mine and bought a better one. I had an Iberital for quite a few years, and I kicked myself when I bought a Mazzer Mini for not changing it sooner.  I had a large Eureka 65 thing very briefly because, despite its specs, it just made the coffee taste flat. Settled on a huge Mazzer Major that is a beast.

[Maverick]

In an ideal world I would have kept the Rancilio grinder and just added the Niche. The hype is justified and the Niche is perfect for espresso and addresses all the weaknesses of the Rancilio - size, appearance, noise and general domestic conformity, it's stepless with very even grind and most of all it really does do zero retention. The zero retention/one dose thing works well for us as my wife is caffiene intolerant and only drinks decaff so it is always 2 different beans/grinds, this is a no waste breeze with the Niche. On the other hand being a conical grinder it doesn't do a brilliant job for pour over brews, too many fine grinds - it isn't outright bad, just could be better. The Rancilio was great at coarse grinds and if there had been room in the kitchen it would have stayed just for that.