Author Topic: Which next drill  (Read 3589 times)

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #25 on: 17 April, 2021, 10:16:01 pm »
I probably wouldn't use it loads, but when I do it'll be proper timber constructions and metalwork.

Of all your thoughts, nikki, this one caught my eye. I once had a battery-powered drill and because I only used it occasionally I nearly always got caught with flat batteries (both of them, I had two). If your usage will be only occasional I wonder whether a corded drill will be the better choice. If you mean it gets regular light use then I don't envisage a problem.

She already covered that:

I'm already fighting power tools being designed for bigger hands than mine, and I find corded tools add extra weight and pull where I don't want it. I don't often have a power outlet near where I'm working either, so it's cordless for me.

Also, a mains-powered drill isn't in the same league when it comes to low-speed control; you can't really drive screws with them.

FWIW, I have a basic mains-powered hammer drill.  It's undeniably a win over my Makita 18V when it comes to masonry (which almost never happens, because landlords), but inferior in all other respects.  If I'm not using the Makita for drilling, it's usually because the drill press or Dremel is a better tool for the job.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #26 on: 17 April, 2021, 10:30:34 pm »
^ Mostly this.
I have an ancient corded Bosch, which rotates in only one direction, has a (fairly useless) speed control on the trigger, but you couldn't really drive screws with it. It is generally my go-to tool when it comes to making a lot of noise and holes in masonry.
The rest (most) of the time, the 18v Makita is pressed into service.
I've not encountered the battery/brick phenomenon and, frankly, I wish I hadn't heard about it.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #27 on: 17 April, 2021, 10:32:09 pm »

My 18v makita LXT drill has no issue drilling masonry...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #28 on: 17 April, 2021, 10:44:41 pm »
Nor does mine.
But if it something that I'm going to be doing all day, I'd rather use the Bosch - which I tend to view as a bit sacrificial/expendable - as opposed to the Makita which comes through the till at five or six times that which the Bosch does.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #29 on: 17 April, 2021, 11:20:20 pm »
Nor does mine.
But if it something that I'm going to be doing all day, I'd rather use the Bosch - which I tend to view as a bit sacrificial/expendable - as opposed to the Makita which comes through the till at five or six times that which the Bosch does.

Either you paid a lot more than I did for the Makita, or your bosch was a tenner...

https://www.toolmax.nl/makita-dhp453rhe-18-v-li-ion-klopboormachine-in-koffer.html

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #30 on: 17 April, 2021, 11:36:58 pm »
Makita was just shy of £240.00 - incl; 2 x batteries, smart charger & case.
Bosch was around £40.00.
Exaggeration was there, albeit not in vast amounts.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #31 on: 17 April, 2021, 11:43:11 pm »
My 18v makita LXT drill has no issue drilling masonry...

Neither does mine, but the Black&Decker[1] mains powered cheapy is still slightly better at it, presumably due to sheer wattage.  At least, while it works - I'm under no illusions as to the relative build quality.

Which I'd use depends on what I have to hand, the availability of mains power, and whether I'm sticking a rawlplug in to hang a picture or bashing my way through the wall to run a cable.


[1] It was a present.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #32 on: 17 April, 2021, 11:44:11 pm »
Makita was just shy of £240.00 - incl; 2 x batteries, smart charger & case.
Bosch was around £40.00.
Exaggeration was there, albeit not in vast amounts.

Yes, but if you damage the drill unit, you don't need to replace the batteries, charger, and case...

So it's only about €70 you'd need to spend to replace it.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #33 on: 17 April, 2021, 11:51:57 pm »
Good point.  :thumbsup:

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #34 on: 18 April, 2021, 07:45:16 am »
My Bosch battery drill (Post no.4 in this thread) will drill 8 mm holes in brick of breeze block with no problems. It will also drive screws and is small enough for my wife and adult daughter to use.

Bigger holes in brick, or where real concrete is involved, and the beast of an SDS impact drill is needed. That is mains powered, and I almost always use it two handed. The SDS impact drills have an impact weight inside, with a mechanism to repeatedly launch that at the back of the drill bit. It is much bigger and much more effective on concrete than the hammer action of some drills. If the drill can have the rotation turned off while still hammering, in my experience it's got to be one of the impact types.

While battery impact drills exist, they are big, heavy and expensive, and probably terrible a driving screws. If you need to drill big holes in normal brick, or you need to drill concrete or the blue bricks, you can't do it with any everyday drill that will also drive screws.
Quote from: Kim
Paging Diver300.  Diver300 to the GSM Trimphone, please...

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #35 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:22:32 am »
My Bosch battery drill (Post no.4 in this thread) will drill 8 mm holes in brick of breeze block with no problems. It will also drive screws and is small enough for my wife and adult daughter to use.

Bigger holes in brick, or where real concrete is involved, and the beast of an SDS impact drill is needed. That is mains powered, and I almost always use it two handed. The SDS impact drills have an impact weight inside, with a mechanism to repeatedly launch that at the back of the drill bit. It is much bigger and much more effective on concrete than the hammer action of some drills. If the drill can have the rotation turned off while still hammering, in my experience it's got to be one of the impact types.

While battery impact drills exist, they are big, heavy and expensive, and probably terrible a driving screws. If you need to drill big holes in normal brick, or you need to drill concrete or the blue bricks, you can't do it with any everyday drill that will also drive screws.

Unless you are drilling concrete frequently, there's no point specing your main electric drill around it. The same way it's pointless to spec your every day electric car, round your once a year 1500km holiday drive. You aren't going to get away with the same drill you use to put a 3mm hole in wood, then follow it up with a wood screw, as you would for putting a 20mm diameter 200mm deep hole into solid concrete. For many of us, the holes in concrete are rare, and the easiest option in that case i to hire an SDS+ drill for the job, or maybe borrow one off a friend.

For everything else, a decent quality battery Makita will do the job just fine.

Lifes too short for shit tools.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #36 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:25:10 am »
While battery impact drills exist, they are big, heavy and expensive, and probably terrible a driving screws. If you need to drill big holes in normal brick, or you need to drill concrete or the blue bricks, you can't do it with any everyday drill that will also drive screws.

Definitely. My friend with his own engineering company does a lot of drilling steel and fixing it on site into concrete, masonry and stone. In his workshop he has huge 3 phase machinery but for the site work he has a selection of battery Hilti drills and drivers. They are amazing things and will make a large and deep hole in anything (steel, concrete whatever) but your looking at £400 for a naked drill without battery and charger. Fine if its your job and you need it but for home use too expensive.
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #37 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:31:24 am »
I was surprised to see tradespeople buying up the Parkside power tools in Lidl until a builder friend explained that they're good enough to use as worktools but cheap enough to consider disposable when they go to the Great Toolbox in the Sky.

I have a Parkside battery drill but its bit speed is slow compared to the ancient corded Black and Decker I got as a 30th birthday present aeons ago and is still going strong although the trigger control has a mind of its own.
They laughed when I said I was going to be a stand-up comedian. They're not laughing now.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #38 on: 18 April, 2021, 11:55:29 am »
I was surprised to see tradespeople buying up the Parkside power tools in Lidl until a builder friend explained that they're good enough to use as worktools but cheap enough to consider disposable when they go to Great Toolbox in the Sky.

The problem then is if Lidl don't have them in you're at the mercy of eBay price gougers selling them for double or triple the in-store price. Maybe they're cheap enough to buy spares.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #39 on: 18 April, 2021, 02:01:07 pm »
Unless you are drilling concrete frequently, there's no point specing your main electric drill around it. The same way it's pointless to spec your every day electric car, round your once a year 1500km holiday drive. You aren't going to get away with the same drill you use to put a 3mm hole in wood, then follow it up with a wood screw, as you would for putting a 20mm diameter 200mm deep hole into solid concrete. For many of us, the holes in concrete are rare, and the easiest option in that case i to hire an SDS+ drill for the job, or maybe borrow one off a friend.
I agree. I would just point out that cheap mains SDS drills are so little money that they make hiring less attractive.

I do own a mains SDS drill (see https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=1241.msg2211214#msg2211214 where it got abused extensively) but it's currently on loan to son-in-law and I haven't used it myself for nearly a year.

The Bosch battery drill rarely goes a week without being used.
Quote from: Kim
Paging Diver300.  Diver300 to the GSM Trimphone, please...

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #40 on: 18 April, 2021, 07:32:10 pm »
Life's too short for shit tools.

J

Not sure if your comment is directed at this comment

My Bosch battery drill (Post no.4 in this thread) ...

are linked, but if you haven't used the Bosch drill you cannot possibly know how good it it is.  I have and it is certainly a very long way from being shit. I am a Makita user and I would happily buy the Bosch mentioned if I didn't already have that base covered.

For an occasional user as Nikki has described herself, it is ideal.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #41 on: 18 April, 2021, 07:59:08 pm »
Life's too short for shit tools.

J

Not sure if your comment is directed at this comment

My Bosch battery drill (Post no.4 in this thread) ...
I assumed that it was general agreement that a monster drill for big holes through real concrete will be shit for 5 mm holes in wood, simply due to the monster drill's size and weight.
Quote from: Kim
Paging Diver300.  Diver300 to the GSM Trimphone, please...

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #42 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:27:31 pm »
I had a look at the Bosch stuff, and decided the blue range was probably what I needed, rather than the green. ('Occasional use' as in it'll get caned for a few days during an installation build or an exhibition hang or a structure fabrication, but then it might be a few months of little or no use before The Next Big Thing.) That bumps prices up towards some of the other brands.

I think that at the intersection of having something with the specs I want, and with diminishing enthusiasm for spending more time pouring over the details, I've found a package for 2 x 2Ah batteries, and a brushless Dewalt with a decently-sized chuck size (a repeating issue with the Aldi drill) for £150. That and one of those useful doodads from upthread should sort me out.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #43 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:38:00 pm »
<Snippety-Snip> ......and one of those useful doodads from upthread should sort me out.
Let me know if you have any luck with that, and if so - where from.
I ordered one from Amazon from the link I posted above.
The updates got as far as 'Out for delivery' today, Sunday.
Then, all of a sudden, it went all 'There's been a terrible mistake, we cannot deliver your order, we'll be issuing a full refund in 5 to  7 working days.
If I go back to that Amazon link, it is now showing delivery as 'One to two months' - which is a bit pants as I cannot find anyone else selling them at that sort of price. Others are selling them, but for a significantly spendier sum.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #44 on: 18 April, 2021, 09:54:14 pm »
Oh dear!

I haven't looked for them yet, but will let you know if I spot something that looks good. What sort of price are you aiming for?

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #45 on: 18 April, 2021, 10:02:43 pm »
Oh dear!

I haven't looked for them yet, but will let you know if I spot something that looks good. What sort of price are you aiming for?
All the others I've seen are nudging towards thirty quid.
As I have two which are similar and still serviceable, my impetus for a new one (yes, yes, yes - I know its a new tool, and that I'm letting the side down) is somewhat quenched.

Re: Which next drill
« Reply #46 on: 18 April, 2021, 10:44:08 pm »
FFX have the same one Jurek linked to for "estimated delivery by 28th April" at £18.99
https://www.ffx.co.uk/Product/Get/Dewalt-Dt7601-Xj-5035048052372-8-Sa-Connector-With-Holder--Pozidriv-No.2

They also have a set with four different size drills for £25.90
https://www.ffx.co.uk/product/Get/Dewalt-Dt7612-Xj-5035048031810-Quick-Change-Accessory-Set

Valiant

  • aka Sam
    • Radiance Audio
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #47 on: 20 April, 2021, 04:35:57 am »
A while back I purchased the Makita 18v Brushless Drill and Impact driver set with 5ah batteries for neigh on £300. No regrets really. I actually I do have one, I should/will purchase a 2ah battery. The 5ah last forever but are also quite heavy and if I'm up a ladder, I'd much prefer a 2ah stuck up its rear. Speed control is brilliant and I have dropped my drill off the top of a ladder and seem seems to function as new with no visible damage.

It replaced my 18v DeWalt XRP nimh drill which was also a great unit at the time but the makita DHP485 does outclass in every way.

I have the Erbauer 18v Impact driver and that is a brilliant piece of kit, the grey/black before they went to blue. If the drill is as good I imagine for the home user it'll be ok.

Thing is though, after many years of bodging it, I'm now an ardent fan of using the right tool for the job. My mains hammer drills have been handing off, having been replaced by a chunky Titan 5kg SDS+ unit, which can drill, hammer drill and hammer. If the Makita can't do it easily, then I bring that out and it chews through anything like butter. I am in love with the palmsize Makita baby SDS though and it's like to by my next purchase as I can so it being super handy when I'm working at heights, or even cycling to jobs.

If you do get a Makita, register it on their site for extended warranty. My 9yo SP6000 Rail Saw was picked up, serviced and returned for free within 10 days. And thats why I like Makita.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you.

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Re: Which next drill
« Reply #48 on: 20 April, 2021, 01:34:19 pm »
FFX have the same one Jurek linked to for "estimated delivery by 28th April" at £18.99
https://www.ffx.co.uk/Product/Get/Dewalt-Dt7601-Xj-5035048052372-8-Sa-Connector-With-Holder--Pozidriv-No.2

They also have a set with four different size drills for £25.90
https://www.ffx.co.uk/product/Get/Dewalt-Dt7612-Xj-5035048031810-Quick-Change-Accessory-Set

Thanks Neil.

I'm wondering if I might have spotted one in the art workshops without realising what it was - I shall have to investigate next time I'm in.

The 5ah last forever but are also quite heavy and if I'm up a ladder, I'd much prefer a 2ah stuck up its rear.

That was pretty much my reasoning (although budget was a big factor too!). My experience with 1.5Ah batteries is they stop about half an hour before I'm ready to!

Anyway, purchase made. Thanks all - I learned a lot!

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Which next drill
« Reply #49 on: 20 April, 2021, 01:45:56 pm »
The 5ah last forever but are also quite heavy and if I'm up a ladder, I'd much prefer a 2ah stuck up its rear.

That was pretty much my reasoning (although budget was a big factor too!). My experience with 1.5Ah batteries is they stop about half an hour before I'm ready to!

I reckon that for normal handheld power tool use[1] I'd much rather have two smaller batteries than one big one: Not just the weight, but it means one can be charging while the other is in use.  3Ah seems to be the sweet spot, as it lasts for the amount of sanding/grinding I'm likely to want to do in one go without a break.

Last time I looked, the price per amp-hour went up in the higher capacity batteries, too.


[1] Sure, if you're running a floodlight or lawnmower or something, a bigger battery is probably more convenient.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...