Author Topic: Trice Q try out....  (Read 7733 times)

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #25 on: 26 June, 2023, 06:19:29 pm »

[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

The single sided hubs are Sturmey X-SD though I would imagine they share most of their internals with the regular X-FD brake hubs.

Ah thanks, I did have a look on the site earlier, but wasn't quite sure [and so, so tired!]

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #26 on: 27 June, 2023, 10:43:24 am »
short update....
Some really good points in there.
simplicity, truth, equality, peace

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #27 on: 27 June, 2023, 11:08:39 am »

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]

I don't have any experience with re-bearing-ing SA hubs, but I did spend a few years working as an engineer for NSK... 

If I was doing it, I'd probably use -2RS rather than the specified ZZ bearings (rubber sealed rather than shielded). There's a theoretical increase in drag from the seals but it's tiny and the bearings should last indefinitely. I would definitely buy named branded product, but beyond that there's no particular advantage of one manufacturer over another.

The most important thing is to be careful fitting them; don't drop them, don't knock them in with a mallet - press them,  only press on the ring that's being fitted (ie outer ring when fitting to a housing, inner ring when fitting to a shaft). At least 90% of warranty returns we saw had failed due to such 'fitting abuse'...
Life is too important to be taken seriously.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #28 on: 27 June, 2023, 06:16:51 pm »

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]

I don't have any experience with re-bearing-ing SA hubs, but I did spend a few years working as an engineer for NSK... 

If I was doing it, I'd probably use -2RS rather than the specified ZZ bearings (rubber sealed rather than shielded). There's a theoretical increase in drag from the seals but it's tiny and the bearings should last indefinitely. I would definitely buy named branded product, but beyond that there's no particular advantage of one manufacturer over another.

The most important thing is to be careful fitting them; don't drop them, don't knock them in with a mallet - press them,  only press on the ring that's being fitted (ie outer ring when fitting to a housing, inner ring when fitting to a shaft). At least 90% of warranty returns we saw had failed due to such 'fitting abuse'...

That's helpful, thanks PhilO
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #29 on: 27 June, 2023, 09:56:54 pm »

[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

The single sided hubs are Sturmey X-SD though I would imagine they share most of their internals with the regular X-FD brake hubs.
The single sided hubs have larger od bearings, presumably to cope with a 12mm axle instead of 10mm.
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is...

mr ben

  • Some routes may be arduous.
    • ramblings and randonees
Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #30 on: 29 June, 2023, 11:26:46 am »

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa

I'm also very unclear on their rack potential

I had a go on one at the York Rally.  Where's the thigh-rubbing emoji?  I've only tried a bent trike once before and this was something else (as indeed were the Sprint and Adventure I also had a go one).  Alas my sofa is also barren.  I asked about luggage generally and the person from ICE said something about them all having touring in mind, but sorry that's a bit vague!

short update....

I managed [with no sleep and 4 mins to spare at the finish] to get round the Flatlands 600 on the Trice over the weekend.
SWB recumbents are not news to me, but trikes are so it was still quite an adventure riding a recumbent trike for the first time.
I really enjoyed trying something different [and professionally built lol]
...
As for PBP - the final curtain for payment in the UK is Saturday. I'm still procrastinating, but I might give the Trice a go on PBP. If that happens - I'm building a [luggage] tailbox, for sure.

Very interested to hear if/how you get on.  How does this compare with your non-trike 600 km experiences?
Think it possible that you may be mistaken.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #31 on: 29 June, 2023, 08:57:54 pm »
Very interested to hear if/how you get on.  How does this compare with your non-trike 600 km experiences?

Will....I'm 64 now, and not having had any cycling experience between the age of 18 and 40 [fags, booze and other things], I would describe myself as a leisure cyclist. I've never been part of a road club, never done any time-trialling and don't have the history of cycling in my legs during those important years of youth etc Many may laugh, but the pace of Audax is quite fast for me. You really do have to keep moving to get round. And if your pace is on the less-speedy side then the whole process can get very stressful as the clock ticks. I'm just not a fast cyclist, regardless of what I'm riding.  And by fast, I mean, quick enough to get ahead of the audax game and accrue enough time to sleep on the longer events. This is what the longer events are all about - being quick enough to get some kip to make life a bit easier for yourself the following day. On PBP 2007, I think I managed to get 4hrs sleep [out of a total of 90hrs!] All three PBP's have been masterclasses in sleep-deprivation. And I suspect this coming one is going to be no different [providing I manage to get there and get round at all]. So we need to look at ourselves first before we go putting too much expectation on the bike.

Having said that, with that kind of tiredness, I am prone to coming off the bike - especially my two-wheel recumbents deep into a longer ride, so the stability of the trike was really a revelation. Climbing 'felt' a tad slower on the trike, but also less stressful in a way due to not having to worry about stayting upright. Gears and more gears.

Bikes get talked about a lot. It's as much about the engine that sits on the bike as well as the bike itself.
Met a guy this year, called Rab -[I don't think he posts here], but he rides a Pelso Brevet - a dual 26" high racer, and he looked pretty useful as a person who rides recumbents on audax. Moves over the ground nicely. Much quicker than me, that's for sure.

Would I have been that much quicker on a VTX than the TriceQ last weekend? Possibly, but somehow I doubt the difference would have been that much at the end of the day.
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #32 on: 30 June, 2023, 11:39:34 am »
Regarding tyres, on an unsuspended Q I'd suggest something having around 40mm width. Although I haven't tried them, the reports are so good I'd suggest the 42-406 Conti Contact Urban. Although there is a 32mm version I believe it comes up narrower, closer to 28mm.

http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0

I think the latest Marathon Racers are pretty decent and good value. I'm using folding Maxxis DTH which have 120 tpi and are comfortable. I did a comparison test with Racers and they were 2% quicker over a week's commuting BUT I  ran the DTHs at 60 psi and the Racers at 45 psi, which is one reason I  think the new Racers are quite decent.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #33 on: 01 July, 2023, 12:40:54 am »
Regarding tyres, on an unsuspended Q I'd suggest something having around 40mm width. Although I haven't tried them, the reports are so good I'd suggest the 42-406 Conti Contact Urban. Although there is a 32mm version I believe it comes up narrower, closer to 28mm.

http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0

I think the latest Marathon Racers are pretty decent and good value. I'm using folding Maxxis DTH which have 120 tpi and are comfortable. I did a comparison test with Racers and they were 2% quicker over a week's commuting BUT I  ran the DTHs at 60 psi and the Racers at 45 psi, which is one reason I  think the new Racers are quite decent.

LWB suggested the Contact Urbans too, and likewise, hasn't tried them.
Interesting you mention the latest Marathan Racers, as opposed to previous versions that maybe weren't so good?
Funnily enough, the Kenda Quests that have come with my mates Q, [must be 15yrs old, most of that time not being used], and show no sign of sidewall deterioration at all!! And they held up just fine on the ride last weekend.
Anyway, plenty to go on...and spend money on....and like all these things, see for oneself.
Thanks
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #34 on: 01 July, 2023, 11:54:24 am »

LWB suggested the Contact Urbans too, and likewise, hasn't tried them.
Interesting you mention the latest Marathan Racers, as opposed to previous versions that maybe weren't so good?
Funnily enough, the Kenda Quests that have come with my mates Q, [must be 15yrs old, most of that time not being used], and show no sign of sidewall deterioration at all!! And they held up just fine on the ride last weekend.
Anyway, plenty to go on...and spend money on....and like all these things, see for oneself.
Thanks
Schwalbe certainly increased the tread depth of the Racers, and they are forever tinkering with compounds so who knows. What's strange is how similar the Durano, the Kojak and the Racer are in their construction but you hear different things about them. In my hands the Kojak tread seems a lot stiffer than the Durano and Racer tread and yet they are all a double layer of nylon RaceGuard. The Racers are quite a tall tyre and the sidewalls seem flexible with 67 threads per inch. Again the Durano and Kojak have similar 67 tpi sidewalls but I'd take the Racers any day. Maybe the extra height and width makes a better rolling tyre.

mr ben

  • Some routes may be arduous.
    • ramblings and randonees
Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #35 on: 03 July, 2023, 04:11:09 pm »

Bikes get talked about a lot. It's as much about the engine that sits on the bike as well as the bike itself.


I am a similarly full value audaxer; a 400 km that starts in the morning is ok, I can stay awake for 24 hours.  Longer than that and I really struggle with the tiny amount of sleep I have time for.
Think it possible that you may be mistaken.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #36 on: 13 August, 2023, 08:00:37 pm »
but I might give the Trice a go on PBP. If that happens - I'm building a [luggage] tailbox, for sure.

Ok, so I don't always follow things through, but I have forced myself to keep my word this time.....being on the wagon helps.

Finished the tailbox today....PBP next Sunday!!!

For those interested in real basic kitchen table carbon fibre layup then I've taken some photos of the build sequence. There is no explanation text, but it's kind of obvious how I've knocked this up. I think.

I have some carbon cloth, and three batches of laminating resin with a view to building a bike. It hasn't happened [I got close].
The resin is about 10 yrs old....so I wondered about it's integrity, but I 'think' it's ok. I made the wheel arch first as a separate item, then the first bit of the main shell then bonded the two together, and built it up from there.

I followed no plan, no dimensions and had idea what I was doing. Make it up as you go along kind of thing. I have a shed at the back of a Butchers Shop, and there is loads of cardboard knocking around from meat deliveries, so I figured I may as well make use of it. That, and about 4 cans of expanding foam.

Tailbox


It's real basic stuff. The main draw back with this very basic wet layup is the lack of proper compression of the laminate and getting all the epoxy out. Carbon fibre done like this can get heavy with too much epoxy floating around. But I don't have access to vacuum bagging right now, so it is what it is.

But, running it round the car park today, I think it will work. I'll take another look after the 1200km of PBP!!

It struck me a few days ago, that changing a visitation in the rear could prove to be somewhat of a pita on a trike, so I made a simple wheel stand out of some 40mm waste pipe wrapped in carbon [photos a bit milky...need to clean phone].
I don't think I'm going to regret making this.
Garry Broad

Kim

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Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #37 on: 13 August, 2023, 08:16:16 pm »
Needs a BHPC race number on it, really...    :demon: :thumbsup:

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #38 on: 13 August, 2023, 08:29:48 pm »
Needs a BHPC race number on it, really...    :demon: :thumbsup:

That......is not such a bad idea.

Tell you what, you've just reminded me of something Kim, as a token of support [I think I stopped my membership a while ago] I have a BHPC long-sleeved shirt from err...2006?....that I have never worn - anywhere. Why? Well, to be honest, I really never liked the logo.....no offense to anybody, but thought it was bloody awful tbh. But, all being well, I will take it to Paris and wear it at the start.
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #39 on: 14 August, 2023, 12:24:54 pm »
I like the stand idea!
simplicity, truth, equality, peace

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #40 on: 14 August, 2023, 12:33:46 pm »
Not so much for visitations (where you can just tip the trike onto its side), but for fettling anything involving chains and gears, it's incredibly useful to have something to prop the rear wheel off the ground, as you'd need to be a 6ft orangutan to be able to turn the cranks at the same time as lifting the rear end.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #41 on: 14 August, 2023, 02:17:08 pm »
The Contact Urbans look smart  :). Have you noticed any improvements over the Kwests?

EDIT: I'd be interested to know the measured width of the 42mm Contact Urbans when mounted on the rims. I'm  toying with the idea of buying a couple for two of my 'bents.

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #42 on: 14 August, 2023, 03:11:55 pm »
I’m planning to make a tailbox for the Windcheetah at some point. I have some Thermahex sheet offcuts that seem to be the way to go for a one-off. https://www.panelsystems.co.uk/product/thermhex-polypropylene-honeycomb-core
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is...

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #43 on: 14 August, 2023, 07:46:36 pm »
Not so much for visitations (where you can just tip the trike onto its side), but for fettling anything involving chains and gears, it's incredibly useful to have something to prop the rear wheel off the ground
Indeed. Originally made for the fairies, but I have to admit to realizing how useful it is to having the back end propped up to adjust gears. [both hand brakes on of course].
I've noticed some scuff marks on both front hubs, presumably from my mate tipping it on it's side, so that has to be guarded against really, it just needs something to protect the hub from getting unnecessarily scratched if tipping it up on the road, which is easily done of course, just need to remember.

The Contact Urbans look smart  :). Have you noticed any improvements over the Kwests?

EDIT: I'd be interested to know the measured width of the 42mm Contact Urbans when mounted on the rims. I'm  toying with the idea of buying a couple for two of my 'bents.

The width of the mounted Contact Urbans is exactly 42mm.
When I first put them on, they didn't sit on the rims at all well - really lob-sided. I thought, 'oh no, this is not good at all', but it turned out I wasn't providing enough air for them to 'pop' onto the rim properly. Reminded me a bit of how a car tyre inflates. They look well meaty.
It's difficult to know how they compare to the Kwests just riding round a car park, but they certainly didn't feel any slower that's for sure. I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

I’m planning to make a tailbox for the Windcheetah at some point. I have some Thermahex sheet offcuts that seem to be the way to go for a one-off. https://www.panelsystems.co.uk/product/thermhex-polypropylene-honeycomb-core

I'm sure you've messed around with composites WB. It's all about preparation and care taken to get as good a mold as possible, and also to avoid any sharp corners that are very difficult to work the fabric round. Convex and curvature are your friends.
It makes you appreciate folk that are skilled at working with composites [people like Geoff Bird and Simon Sanderson from BHPC] because although simple in one sense, it's a real art to produce results with a good finish - that also have the necessary strength integrity as well. A tailbox is a good place to start though.
Like with so many things experience is everything. I think when you get good at it, people seem to prefer pre-preg over wet layups. Maybe.
Just need one of your dynamo windmills now :-)
Garry Broad

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #44 on: 14 August, 2023, 08:57:56 pm »
I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

That'll be 5.99844bar  ;)

Re: Trice Q try out....
« Reply #45 on: 15 August, 2023, 10:06:09 am »
I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

That'll be 5.99844bar  ;)

Right, I'll have to be mindful of that - it says 6bar on the tyre!  :)
Garry Broad