Author Topic: Prizes for first back.  (Read 4216 times)

wilkyboy

  • "nick" by any other name
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Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2018, 11:20:01 am »
Prizes for first back turn the rides into races. End of.

I'm with Sir Wobbly on this — no matter how small the gesture, it's a gesture that would, I believe, have a definite and unwelcome legal significance.

FWIW, if someone on my events has an audacious ride and scrapes back in with seconds left on the clock then we do usually give them something extra, especially if they're new to audax, to give them a bit of encouragement to have another go.  But never for arriving back first for first's sake.

Those who arrive back first usually get to help us set the hall out again, after the martial-arts group have had their time, before they can then sit down and enjoy Mrs WB's delicious soup and cake  ;D
RRTY #6 done; #7 aborted.  Cambridge Autumnals 27 October.

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2018, 11:21:02 am »
Prizes for first back turn the rides into races. End of.

not true... a beer won't make any difference...

I don't think you get my point.

Prizes (irrespective of what the prizes actually are) for first, second, third, etc. mean the event is a race.

The police and the CPS (and insurers!) would take a very dim view of unauthorised racing on the public highway.
You're only as successful as your last 1200...

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2018, 11:29:33 am »
Right!

Yes it was me that placed the comment about beers on the Facebook Group for the forthcoming Beyond the Dyke audax.  It was a little bit of lighthearted fun for many of my participants who don't take life too seriously and the matter is not mentioned anywhere else on the internet or the AUK calendar page.  As Whoasthewheel suggests:
Quote
I appreciate the Audax world is a bare bone budget one, but seeing a bottle of beer as a "prize to the winner" takes some stretch of imagination.


Therefore I have withdrawn the offer of a free beer for the three 'most efficient riders' and replace the offering. A bottle of beer will be awarded to:

- The Lantern Rouge
- Any person that enters this event within 60 minutes of this posting on YACF: Entries at http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/19-120/
- The 27th arrival
- A person who completes the ride against the greatest of all adversarial circumstances (solely judged by the organiser without reference to a committee). 
- To all my volunteers who support all the excellent riders at this event.

Everyone will be awarded a good portion of chilli-con-carne, scones with butter, clotted cream and jam upon their return. Vegan options available.



PS. The event is not a race
KIDDERMINSTER KILLER AND CLEE AUDAX, 20th July 2019; SOUTH SALOPIAN, 5th Oct 2019. http://beaconrcc.org.uk/audaxes/

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #28 on: September 12, 2018, 11:30:41 am »
I finished last* on the Upper Thames 200 in 2016 due to bouts of severe cramp along the route,
and an untimely puncture towards the end. I was well fed at the end though. :thumbsup:


*Ok, there was lack of fitness to take into consideration as well, as cycling isn't my number one hobby at the moment.

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #29 on: September 12, 2018, 11:38:31 am »
......... A bottle of beer will be awarded to:

- Any person that enters this event within 60 minutes of this posting on YACF: Entries at http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/19-120/


Entered and I will donate my beer to a worthy cause of my choice.  Do I have to complete the ride to claim the beer?

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #30 on: September 12, 2018, 11:40:18 am »
Right!

Yes it was me that placed the light hearted comment about beers on the Facebook

I didn’t want to name and shame! I wasn’t sure if it was just me being a curmudgeonly bugger hence wanting to find out opinions, but it just didn’t feel right.

A bottle of beer will be awarded to:
- The Lantern Rouge
- Any person that enters this event within 60 minutes of this posting on YACF: Entries at http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/19-120/
- The 27th Arrival
- A person who completes the ride against the greatest of all adversarial circumstances (solely judged by the organiser without reference to a committee). 
- To all my volunteers who support all the excellent riders at this event.

Fantastic! Unfortunately I am away for this one. But this has encouraged me to keep supporting these events in the future. The ‘prizes’, were putting me off...

John

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #31 on: September 12, 2018, 11:41:54 am »
......... A bottle of beer will be awarded to:

- Any person that enters this event within 60 minutes of this posting on YACF: Entries at http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/19-120/


Entered and I will donate my beer to a worthy cause of my choice.  Do I have to complete the ride to claim the beer?

Just received your entry, Richard. Consider yourself the lucky winner of the non-prize of a Teme Valley bottle of beer.   Just collect it on the day. 

I have extended the deadline to 12.29;  any more entries?
KIDDERMINSTER KILLER AND CLEE AUDAX, 20th July 2019; SOUTH SALOPIAN, 5th Oct 2019. http://beaconrcc.org.uk/audaxes/

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #32 on: September 12, 2018, 11:44:39 am »
Be honest; you only brought this up because the diversity thread was slowing down, didn't you?

I love threads like this.

Gives me a chance to update the old iggy list.

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #33 on: September 12, 2018, 11:44:51 am »


I don't think you get my point.

Prizes (irrespective of what the prizes actually are) for first, second, third, etc. mean the event is a race.

The police and the CPS (and insurers!) would take a very dim view of unauthorised racing on the public highway.

I do get your point, but your point is dogmatic.
The Police will have a large laugh at anyone suggesting that because a bottle of beer was on offer for the first finisher... it therefore turned this into a race.
I would like to believe that the police have more serious matters to deal with that whether or not a bottle of beer turns a ride into a race.




Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #34 on: September 12, 2018, 11:47:14 am »
While I understand the comment may have been light hearted, and Philip has my utmost respect as an organiser, I do not support giving some riders more favourable treatment than others and fully endorse the comments of Wobbly and wilkyboy.

In essence, audax is a non-competitive activity and treating any rider differently to others, based on a time of finish, goes against the whole ethos of audax.  The aim is simply to complete the course within the time limits.  If you are first back then congratulate yourself and once recovered start helping the organiser in any way you can.

Be honest; you only brought this up because the diversity thread was slowing down, didn't you?

My thoughts entirely!

j_a_m_e_s_

  • Prisoner 17091
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Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #35 on: September 12, 2018, 11:49:01 am »


I don't think you get my point.

Prizes (irrespective of what the prizes actually are) for first, second, third, etc. mean the event is a race.

The police and the CPS (and insurers!) would take a very dim view of unauthorised racing on the public highway.

I do get your point, but your point is dogmatic.
The Police will have a large laugh at anyone suggesting that because a bottle of beer was on offer for the first finisher... it therefore turned this into a race.
I would like to believe that the police have more serious matters to deal with that whether or not a bottle of beer turns a ride into a race.

No, but some weaslylawyer could get a driver off of a serious charge if there was a crash through some legal loophole  if it transpired prizes were given for places.
Rule 77

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #36 on: September 12, 2018, 11:50:42 am »
The Police will have a large laugh at anyone suggesting that because a bottle of beer was on offer for the first finisher... it therefore turned this into a race.
I would like to believe that the police have more serious matters to deal with that whether or not a bottle of beer turns a ride into a race.

Goodness me.

You've never had dealings with the police, have you?

(Oh, and I assume you were referring to the constabulary and not the popular 80's beat combo when you typed "The Police")
You're only as successful as your last 1200...

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #37 on: September 12, 2018, 11:53:27 am »
Bugger you lot discussing prizes.

I want some more bottles of beer to hand out to persons entering before 12.29 today.  http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/19-120/

KIDDERMINSTER KILLER AND CLEE AUDAX, 20th July 2019; SOUTH SALOPIAN, 5th Oct 2019. http://beaconrcc.org.uk/audaxes/

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #38 on: September 12, 2018, 12:05:27 pm »
Can you make sure it's cold? I hate warm ale...

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #39 on: September 12, 2018, 12:08:33 pm »
Can you make sure it's cold? I hate warm ale...

Will you be vying for 27th place?  I hear that there will be congregation of audaxers standing outside of GHQ waiting until the 27th place becomes available.  Any other poor unsuspecting rider ahead of 27th place will be shoved through the door with brevet card in hand.
KIDDERMINSTER KILLER AND CLEE AUDAX, 20th July 2019; SOUTH SALOPIAN, 5th Oct 2019. http://beaconrcc.org.uk/audaxes/

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #40 on: September 12, 2018, 12:08:43 pm »
The Police will have a large laugh at anyone suggesting that because a bottle of beer was on offer for the first finisher... it therefore turned this into a race.
I would like to believe that the police have more serious matters to deal with that whether or not a bottle of beer turns a ride into a race.

Goodness me.

You've never had dealings with the police, have you?

(Oh, and I assume you were referring to the constabulary and not the popular 80's beat combo when you typed "The Police")

To be honest, I think they would be far more interested in their blood alcohol level after they had a couple of servings of your pudding at one of the controls...  :thumbsup:

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #41 on: September 12, 2018, 12:35:53 pm »
Can you make sure it's cold? I hate warm ale...

Will you be vying for 27th place?  I hear that there will be congregation of audaxers standing outside of GHQ waiting until the 27th place becomes available.  Any other poor unsuspecting rider ahead of 27th place will be shoved through the door with brevet card in hand.

I need to finish before 5 PM... I guess that means being "a contender"  ;D

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #42 on: September 12, 2018, 12:44:28 pm »
The finishing times of all LEL riders are published by Les Randonneurs Mondiaux (which is the validation body). PBP (i.e. ACP) publishes finishing times. I'm not sure there is a rule within AUK to say that finish times absolutely cannot be published for rides it validates. As we know, rides are run by individual organisers not by AUK.

"Regulation 9.10 Results: AUK events are not races and no timed results list or placings list of any AUK event may be published."

Ah yes, not sure how I missed that, thanks. That seems pretty final.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #43 on: September 12, 2018, 12:48:40 pm »
Be honest; you only brought this up because the diversity thread was slowing down, didn't you?

I love threads like this.

Gives me a chance to update the old iggy list.

Am I on it now? ;D

LMT

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #44 on: September 12, 2018, 01:40:24 pm »
Prizes for first back turn the rides into races. End of.

not true... a beer won't make any difference...if I decided I want to be the first back, I will try and do so, if I am not bothered, it's not a beer that will change my mind. It's a non issue... a beer is not a trophy

Nice strawman.

Beer, a medal, a mug - it's all the same. A prize means it's a race.

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #45 on: September 12, 2018, 02:56:44 pm »
I’ve said on this forum before that the appeal is that they are non-competitive endurance rides and not races. I got fed up with riding sportives (and I’ve still not done one since I made the switch) because others were cheating, taking unnecessary risks or racing on them. On an Audax you either finish in the time limit or you don’t. To hear of riders waiting for controls to open baffles me. Stop at a ‘spoons and enjoy a burger and pint. I made a comeback to racing and TT this year (only minor), so I use my carbon racer (no ‘guards) and TT bike on those, not on an Audax (and especially not on a full mudguard compulsory one) in an attempt to be one of the first back (not even for a free beer!).

Does that sound like a rant?
Bikes are for riding, not cleaning!

frankly frankie

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Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #46 on: September 12, 2018, 03:33:50 pm »
I think you're missing the point that an audax can be all things to all people.  If others want to race ride as fast as they can, don't be baffled by it, just let it go.  And if you enjoy riding your carbon racer, why not ride it round an audax?
"This is a complex subject, with a need for more than one highlighter pen."

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #47 on: September 12, 2018, 03:59:56 pm »
I am glad this is turning once again into a "fitter rider" bashing and witch hunt...
so much for the alleged diversity we are all seeking...  ::-)

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #48 on: September 12, 2018, 04:12:55 pm »
Can you please point out any bashing of fitter riders or any witches being hunted in this thread?
You're only as successful as your last 1200...

Re: Prizes for first back.
« Reply #49 on: September 12, 2018, 04:14:23 pm »
What a bunch of cry babies.