Author Topic: LEL2021 - route details  (Read 11786 times)

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #175 on: May 10, 2019, 08:44:38 am »
This is an area and roads I know well and ride a lot.

My chosen route from Moffat to FRB (variations on Fifeingeejits suggestion) would be : https://ridewithgps.com/routes/29933515


Ta, will need to remember this thread next time I need to head that way :-)

+1 for that. Thanks for the route through the Calders and Livingstone - very useful.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #176 on: May 10, 2019, 10:52:16 am »
This is an area and roads I know well and ride a lot.

My chosen route from Moffat to FRB (variations on Fifeingeejits suggestion) would be : https://ridewithgps.com/routes/29933515


Ta, will need to remember this thread next time I need to head that way :-)

+1 for that. Thanks for the route through the Calders and Livingston - very useful.

I work in Livingston. I rode a small piece of that route this morning. I'm happy to go and explore/take photos/make notes if that would be helpful.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #177 on: May 10, 2019, 10:52:50 am »
Michael Broadwith went from Abington to the Bridge on his End to End. Which tends to suggest that it's the fastest way. https://frrt.org/endtoend2018/map?center=54.63570,-3.93311&zoom=5.

I was filming that ride from Preston onwards on my own. So I had to choose significant and scenic places for good shots. Each set-up takes time and effort, so desire to film is a good indicator of 'scenic' value. I didn't bother following Michael from Beattock to the Bridge. I went on the A701, as it's a more interesting way to Edinburgh, and I wouldn't get lost. I got a good shot on the Forth bridge, but it wasn't much different from one on the Humber bridge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LTFDLDE7o4

The most commented on parts of the LEL are Teesdale/Yad Moss/Tynedale, The Granites to Langholm, and the Castle Howard complex. The Howardian Hills roller coaster gets a mixed response, but forms part of the Castle Howard section. I'd always take time to set up for those sections.

The sections further South are more generic. Location finding consists of looking for villages on Google Earth which might have colourful houses, possibly thatched, and working out when groups might appear.

Cambridge is an interesting case. I filmed there in the middle of the day in 2015 on a Hackney 200, and it was so crowded that it was difficult to get clean shots. On LEL I waited until about 8pm, and it was quiet. I could get interviews, and shots of riders passing Kings College, without fighting the crowds. I'd anticipate Edinburgh being much the same, with some possible good shots if I could be sure of anyone diverting. In 2009 I had a similar idea for Lincoln. The Cathedral and Castle were a 200 metre detour from the route. No interest was shown.

So I look at the filming options on the route as currently described. There will be some opportunities in Queensferry/Dalmeny, possibly on Bankhead Road, close to the Start/Finish of the Daylight 600. https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.982843,-3.3737497,3a,75y,328.36h,71.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szbz_DkDL-VP83OE7al6QLw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en&authuser=0
I am a bit perplexed as to why they planted that row of trees though, they'll spoil a view of the rail bridge.

I'm a bit concerned that a Malton control might take Castle Howard out of the route.

I am moving away from film-making, riders do a lot of it themselves these days, and I've got a massive archive of Audax material. The changing nature of the field has been interesting, becoming more international, and younger. But the communication systems that have facilitated that are now mature, with all the challenges that maturity brings.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #178 on: May 10, 2019, 11:45:04 am »
The Broadwith route is more direct and doesn't involve faffing about on cycle paths which the other route does (Broadwith would have had a following car, wouldn't he?). The other route is probably more fiddly and will probably require more concentration on navigation. I would cycle all the roads on the Broadwith route. That wee chunk of A71 would be busy depending on time of day. I wouldn't spend a lot of time on the A71 by choice, but others do.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #179 on: May 10, 2019, 11:56:30 am »
Michael Broadwith went from Abington to the Bridge on his End to End. Which tends to suggest that it's the fastest way. https://frrt.org/endtoend2018/map?center=54.63570,-3.93311&zoom=5.

I've ridden this route twice and confirm it's a good - no issues. I prefer it mainly as it avoids the bad road surfaces on the A701 from the top of Devil's Beeftub down towards Edinburgh - the jarring and vibration really spoil what should be a rewarding descent - bloody logging trucks  :demon:.  Whilst not as spectacular as the Beeftub, the small roads from Abingdon onwards are very pretty through the rolling glens.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #180 on: May 10, 2019, 12:02:51 pm »
It would be difficult to police that section to stop ultra-racers using it, even if you wanted to.

I've driven the A701 a number of times. It's alright at the weekends, but lorries do tend to drive on the speed limiter, as it's less policed than the A702. It's difficult to outpace an empty timber wagon in a Vauxhall Astra, when they know the road, and you don't.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small just Far Away at the back
Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #181 on: May 10, 2019, 01:04:12 pm »
On LeJog:

The A9 between Perth and Inverness is going to be a series of roadworks for at least the next 10 years; there's been rumblings along it of the possibility it will gain special road status in the process, as the bridges on the current NMU route from Calvine to Dalnaspiddal that are blocked to motorized traffic are apparently getting upgraded as part of it.

Whether that's local rumor or has truth in it is probably hidden away on the Transport Scotland website; but since that route is critical to LEJOG records we're unlikely to see many successful record attempts.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #182 on: May 10, 2019, 02:00:16 pm »

<snipped> The most commented on parts of the LEL are Teesdale/Yad Moss/Tynedale, The Granites to Langholm, and the Castle Howard complex. The Howardian Hills roller coaster gets a mixed response, but forms part of the Castle Howard section. I'd always take time to set up for those sections.

The sections further South are more generic. <snipped>


That's useful to someone like me who is thinking about doing LEL for the first time because it's difficult to get an idea of how scenic the route is.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #183 on: May 10, 2019, 04:37:40 pm »
In 2005 I bought a set of Touring Maps for Motorcyclists from Lidl. They're waterproof, and a convenient scale. They're based on German mapping, and they have scenic roads marked with green dots. Those dotted routes are therefore the more desirable roads to tour in the UK. Barnard Castle to Brampton features.

There's a big cluster of routes in the Borders. The roads are obviously going to vary in suitability for sending 1,500 cyclists down. There are loads around Peebles. It's quite difficult to devise a route to Edinburgh that avoids those scenic roads. The Broadwith LEJOG route nearly gets there.


Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #184 on: May 11, 2019, 07:51:24 am »
My chosen route from Moffat to FRB (variations on Fifeingeejits suggestion) would be : https://ridewithgps.com/routes/29933515

100+ km? That's going to be one the longest stretch without a control. Hopefully not too many reach Moffat on Monday night and decide to leave it till the morning like they did for Louth-Pocklington.
Well, that's pretty much a given if the chosen controls are Moffat and Dunfermline. Even the most direct of routes from Moffat will result in 100km+ !!

This route avoids the heaviest trafficed/fast A roads in the main, sticking to pleasant country roads that have little traffic. A small cycle path diversion to avoid the big Lizzie Bryce roundabout on the A71 - though I think I personally would take the road. Possibly a different matter (or risk assessment) for non-locals and tired Audaxers.

There are slightly more direct routes using either the A701 South of the Pentlands, or the A70 North, and while neither are particularly heavily trafficed (for A roads), they still have their share of fast and potentially impatient traffic.

Anyway, just presenting options from local knowledge and experience - at the end of the day the orgs can I'm sure be trusted to present an interesting and viable route.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small just Far Away at the back
Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #185 on: May 11, 2019, 10:58:20 am »
My chosen route from Moffat to FRB (variations on Fifeingeejits suggestion) would be : https://ridewithgps.com/routes/29933515

100+ km? That's going to be one the longest stretch without a control. Hopefully not too many reach Moffat on Monday night and decide to leave it till the morning like they did for Louth-Pocklington.
Well, that's pretty much a given if the chosen controls are Moffat and Dunfermline. Even the most direct of routes from Moffat will result in 100km+ !!

This route avoids the heaviest trafficed/fast A roads in the main, sticking to pleasant country roads that have little traffic. A small cycle path diversion to avoid the big Lizzie Bryce roundabout on the A71 - though I think I personally would take the road. Possibly a different matter (or risk assessment) for non-locals and tired Audaxers.

There are slightly more direct routes using either the A701 South of the Pentlands, or the A70 North, and while neither are particularly heavily trafficed (for A roads), they still have their share of fast and potentially impatient traffic.

Anyway, just presenting options from local knowledge and experience - at the end of the day the orgs can I'm sure be trusted to present an interesting and viable route.

After 80km you're into well populated areas, and although seemingly not quite having the same 24/7/363 opening of supermarkets as you'll find in Fife and the North East, chances are you'll find something open.

24hr petrol station shops at MidCalder, Newbridge and Queensferry as well as 24hr McDonalds all within a couple of hundred meters of the route.




Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #186 on: May 11, 2019, 05:43:23 pm »
In 2005 I bought a set of Touring Maps for Motorcyclists from Lidl. They're waterproof, and a convenient scale. They're based on German mapping, and they have scenic roads marked with green dots. Those dotted routes are therefore the more desirable roads to tour in the UK. Barnard Castle to Brampton features.

There's a big cluster of routes in the Borders. The roads are obviously going to vary in suitability for sending 1,500 cyclists down. There are loads around Peebles. It's quite difficult to devise a route to Edinburgh that avoids those scenic roads. The Broadwith LEJOG route nearly gets there.


Thanks, good idea. I had a quick look in Aldi and Lidl this afternoon but no luck. I think Michelin maps have that feature as well so I'll try those too.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #187 on: May 11, 2019, 08:09:15 pm »


Thanks, good idea. I had a quick look in Aldi and Lidl this afternoon but no luck. I think Michelin maps have that feature as well so I'll try those too.

They were something that Lidl did when they had motorcycle stuff for sale. I haven't seen them for many years, and they don't seem to come up for sale on the net. They were handy because they could be written on with chinagraph pencil, to mark the route of a ride. All a bit of a lost art now.

There is a route for the 2005 LEL online. https://www.bikemap.net/en/r/13850/
It shows the route as being a bit short of 1400 km. Prior to online mapping it was more difficult to get a total mileage. That route had some difficult laney sections that caused a lot of head scratching, especially around Thurlby. A lot of people would have got up to over 1400 after a few diversions. There were some very obvious shortcuts from Cheshunt to Thurlby, which was the first control.

There were a couple of pan flat sections, the longest was broken up by the Thorne control. That was also the start for half the field. So Thorne starters only experienced that as a continuous section once, they went North first.

That meant that they split the ride into two sections. A hilly 800, followed by a less hilly 600. When you made it back to Thorne you could aim to set out to London at the control closing time, and treat it almost as a separate ride.

You can't adopt that approach with a London start, because of the possibility of a headwind, which makes the two parts very unequal. The more recent breed of 1000 km rides work in a similar way, usually in the form of a cloverleaf.

There are a variety of opinions about the historic routes, and they are bound up with specific memories of controls, companions and the two very different experiences of the London or Thorne starts. All a long time ago now, and a world away.

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #188 on: May 11, 2019, 10:35:19 pm »
I was curious to know who was using a GPS on LEL in 2005. It turns out to be Juergen Steinfelder. He got to about 500km before pulling out with an ITB problem, which is a typical injury. That means he must have created the route for the event, rather than recording his ride. That's assuming there wasn't a GPX available then.
https://spinstone.square7.ch/index.php/long-distance-cycling/london-edinburgh-london-2005

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #189 on: May 31, 2019, 07:31:35 am »
This latest proposal by Edinburgh Council (Meadows to George Street Cycling/walking improvements) might help with joining up a sensible route through the City Centre.

If it gets through planning and completed in time, obviously

https://meadowstogeorgestreet.info/project-details/


Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #190 on: May 31, 2019, 09:29:49 am »
This latest proposal by Edinburgh Council (Meadows to George Street Cycling/walking improvements) might help with joining up a sensible route through the City Centre.

If it gets through planning and completed in time, obviously

https://meadowstogeorgestreet.info/project-details/

Unfortunately, on closer reading, construction in 2022  :'(

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #191 on: May 31, 2019, 01:55:17 pm »
Will there still be an option to avoid the A74 in 2021?

This was the part of the route I enjoyed most in 2017 - https://ridewithgps.com/routes/22451603

vorsprung

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Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #192 on: May 31, 2019, 03:41:11 pm »
Will there still be an option to avoid the A74 in 2021?

This was the part of the route I enjoyed most in 2017 - https://ridewithgps.com/routes/22451603

It was a really nice scenic route but the weather when I did it was benign and it was light.  In the dark or in rain it would be horrendous.  There was one bit of road that was literally more pothole than road.  I had intended to take the main road but I loaded the wrong GPS file :) . Glad I did
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Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #193 on: June 11, 2019, 11:36:13 am »
Will there still be an option to avoid the A74 in 2021?

This was the part of the route I enjoyed most in 2017 - https://ridewithgps.com/routes/22451603

The section north from Boreland towards Moffat has been repaired since 2017. So I would hope that it would be back on the recommended route.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small just Far Away at the back
Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #194 on: June 11, 2019, 12:41:53 pm »
Will there still be an option to avoid the A74 in 2021?

This was the part of the route I enjoyed most in 2017 - https://ridewithgps.com/routes/22451603

The section north from Boreland towards Moffat has been repaired since 2017. So I would hope that it would be back on the recommended route.

I found a T-Junction on Moffat Toffee this year that was mostly gravel, though that's considerably better than the previous year where I found a section of road that was mostly mud.

wilkyboy

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Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #195 on: June 11, 2019, 07:30:11 pm »
Will there still be an option to avoid the A74 in 2021?

This was the part of the route I enjoyed most in 2017 - https://ridewithgps.com/routes/22451603

The section north from Boreland towards Moffat has been repaired since 2017. So I would hope that it would be back on the recommended route.

Thanks — we are certainly going to test-ride that whole section with a view to using it, as it would certainly improve the Brampton-Moffat leg  :thumbsup:
RRTY #7 done.  Need something else to do ... ah, welcome #8 8)

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #196 on: June 12, 2019, 01:37:51 pm »
Thanks for all the input.  It's all very useful  :thumbsup:

Alwyn and I will revisit the route through the capital, as we were discussing several options.  At the end of the day, a few minutes hike-a-bike through the dead centre is nought compared to 120 hours pedalling the rest of the way.  It's still a couple of years off, we still intend to take you through some of the best bits  ;)


Appreciate it's a long way off but (roughly) when would you be looking for volunteers for Dunfermline?  Local to me and might be able to get DCC clubmates involved as well.  My commute crosses the FRB into central Edinburgh so will be interested to see the final route.

Thanks!

Fidgetbuzz

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Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #197 on: June 12, 2019, 03:24:42 pm »
Crikey .. that is advance planning . There is a meeting of the team including controllers on 23rd November. Provided one of us remembers we will flag your generous offer to the Dunfermline controller .. and normal pattern would be for them to drive recruiting of local vols .. with the central allocation of willing volunteers who are happy to be placed anywhere .. taking place in the last 3 months before the event. The shout out for vols will only really start at the beginning of 2021.  My view  from 2013 and 17 experience .. and I am  not aware of any different plans for 21.
I was an accountant until I discovered Audax !!

Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #198 on: June 13, 2019, 08:56:46 am »
Ah no worries - still, it's only about 18 months away...  ;)

I'm already thinking of the 5 year plan I might need for riding it in 2025  ;D

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: LEL2021 - route details
« Reply #199 on: June 13, 2019, 02:03:50 pm »

Some of my Randonneurs NL friends have asked me about how they can ride 2021. Most of them aren't AUK members, and won't have the number of LRM rides for a guaranteed place.

What are the options? I'd like to be able to give a useful answer then they ask next.

J
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