Author Topic: Arrivee redesign  (Read 2646 times)

Arrivee redesign
« on: December 01, 2019, 10:34:29 am »
We've had the new swish design for a while now, and I still can't engage with it. The old design was 'by the people, for the people', I felt some connection with it. The new one, although more professional looking, makes it just another magazine. I don't bother with reading Arrivee now, quick flick through then into the recycling.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2019, 11:53:15 am »
That seems a bit 'cut off your nose to spite your face'. Perhaps the aesthetics aren't to everyone's taste, but the content continues to be superb and varied IMHO.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2019, 01:14:03 pm »
I like the varied content of /Vvvvee, and the redesign in general.  Tho... IMO some of the image content is unecessarily large  throughout e.g. the double page spread image of a cut pork pie, which doesn't look that appertising - though I'm sure it tastes great...  ;) 
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

MikeFromLFE

  • Previously known as Millimole
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2019, 04:14:35 pm »
The pie doesn't look in the least appetising. Too much magnification.
Too many angry people - breathe & relax.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Dormant but requires tea
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2019, 06:21:15 pm »
I thought the double page spread 16-17 in the latest issue was great design, using the grey sky as a naturally contrasting background for the text and leaving the landscape visible.
The unwilling rider and the one who leaves each control in turn without reluctance, with no desire to come back, obviously cannot be making the same journey, even though their brevets are identical.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2019, 10:24:18 am »
The renewed Arrivee format is great improvement and I am less likely to deposit it in the bin.
KIDDERMINSTER KILLER AND CLEE AUDAX, 20th July 2019; SOUTH SALOPIAN, 5th Oct 2019. http://beaconrcc.org.uk/audaxes/

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2019, 09:47:11 am »
I thought the double page spread 16-17 in the latest issue was great design, using the grey sky as a naturally contrasting background for the text and leaving the landscape visible.

You can't be serious !!  (I assume you mean the spread on 14-15, not 16-17)

And what about the over-enlarged image on 22-23 ?
It's not dark yet but it's getting there.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Dormant but requires tea
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2019, 10:26:36 am »
Yes, 14-15, sorry.
The unwilling rider and the one who leaves each control in turn without reluctance, with no desire to come back, obviously cannot be making the same journey, even though their brevets are identical.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2019, 10:39:31 am »
using the grey sky as a naturally contrasting background for the text and leaving the landscape visible.
I wish they wouldn't, looks great but I find it difficult to read.  Boring black text on a white background would be my preference, the content needs to be readable not win an art award.
Otherwise, I like the magazine.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2019, 08:45:08 am »
I found several pages of this issue almost unreadable due to the lack of visibility of the text. Some of us are colour-blind and need a reasonable contrast between text and background. So, black on white, please, or even white on black, but no more of this grey on grey.

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2019, 05:20:20 pm »
I love what has been done with the magazine.

The old one was great and a lot of people invested a great deal of time trying to make a format fly that was very earthbound. I thing Ged has brought it up to date and if it 'looks like another cycling magazine" I'm not going to moan about following modern good practice.

I can't speak for the accessibility/readability issues but I think the breaking up of the copy into small bits (e.g page 28/29) makes the content more attractive and I think the practice of having photos of cyclists from the front is a great improvement.

I'm sure Ged and Redlight welcome constructive comments but overall I would be willing to bet the vast majority of us think it's brill.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2019, 01:05:16 pm »
I found several pages of this issue almost unreadable due to the lack of visibility of the text. Some of us are colour-blind and need a reasonable contrast between text and background. So, black on white, please, or even white on black, but no more of this grey on grey.

+1

Design top tip:  If it's hard to read (or doesn't make sense) when rendered in greyscale, then it's going to be difficult for people with some form of colourblindness.


Apart from that, and 'Awoowoo' jokes aside, I quite like the new format.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2019, 08:14:49 pm »
p14-15 load of text on grey sky background, much of it unreadable
p26-29 really pretty layout, mostly v readable apart from a daft small script font in places
p38-41 photo captions done RIGHT (on plain boxes)  :thumbsup:

p47 text over foliage
p48 Text over a grey road
p52 Gorgeous Llangrannog - tiny caption for the statue, against grainy green background
p56-57 picture huuugely stretched, possibly deliberately to give space to write the caption over it. But 2 very nice pics on this page  :thumbsup:


And what about the over-enlarged image on 22-23 ?
Actually I quite like the old/fuzzy/low-fi look that page has, suiting the subject matter !


Design top tip:  If it's hard to read (or doesn't make sense) when rendered in greyscale, then it's going to be difficult for people with some form of colourblindness.


Apart from that, and 'Awoowoo' jokes aside, I quite like the new format.
+1

And I'm only slightly red-green colour-blind.

There's just no need for this, and we've been pointing it out since the first redesign issue :(
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2019, 08:55:49 pm »

Design top tip:  If it's hard to read (or doesn't make sense) when rendered in greyscale, then it's going to be difficult for people with some form of colourblindness.


Apart from that, and 'Awoowoo' jokes aside, I quite like the new format.
+1

And I'm only slightly red-green colour-blind.

I think these sort of things are less about colour discrimination, and more that people with colourblindness learn to focus on (sometimes quite small) differences in contrast over differences in colour.  So when people make a colour-only distinction in some design, we're often lost, even if we can discriminate it once we know what to look for.  (See also: The 'small objects don't have colour' phenomenon.)

Looking for hmm-I-think-that's-a-different-batch-of-blue-dye level colour differences is one thing when you're pairing socks or decoding wiring looms, but well into the realm of Type 2 Fun when it comes to reading bodies of text.  Especially if you've swamped out the colour difference with contrast-based camouflage (eg. text over foliage).
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2019, 09:00:10 pm »
I'm (like a lot of people) somewhat, but not debilitatingly colour blind. I couldn't be a pilot, but I can function from day to day.

Generally speaking, if something interests me enough, I'll make an effort to read it - even if it's hard work.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2019, 09:07:04 pm »
I could just read pages 14 & 15 with both eyes. (My right eye is 'normal' and my left is damaged by optic neuritis and has poor colour vision & reduced acuity.)

White on pale does create a lack of contrast, which is suboptimal.

It's kind of handy to have eyes I can use to test some things...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2019, 09:20:12 pm »
Generally speaking, if something interests me enough, I'll make an effort to read it - even if it's hard work.

+1

The lesson is therefore to either write interesting articles, or make your designs easily accessible to your readers.  Given that the average Awoowoo article is a variation on the same "We went for a long bike ride.  There was Weather.   We sheltered in a fuel station eating Frijj and Ginsters.  Someone had a puncture, then their pump fell apart.  There was a bastard hill.  My knees hurt.  The organisers laid on a fantastic spread of CAKE.  Stopped for a snooze in a ditch and was molested by a sheep.  There was headwind.  Finished with an hour in hand.  Still got neuropathy 6 weeks later." theme, it seems extra important to make an effort with the design.  I'd say the more interesting use of photographs[1] in the new format is doing just that, occasionally to the detriment of the text.



[1] I, for one, mostly read Arivee to look at the pictures.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Manotea

  • Where there is doubt...
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2019, 11:17:35 pm »
I'm not missing the 5 or 6 pages of text giving the blow by blow - or should that be gingster by gingster - account of a fortnight tour. The new design and editorial style might feel a bit more - for want of a better term - tabloid/graphic comic -  but the end result is - for me at least - much more accessible and engaging.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2019, 12:04:17 am »
I've not much liked the blow by blow accounts either - except mine, of course  ;)
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Karla

  • car(e) free
    • Lost Byway - around the world by bike
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2019, 12:16:32 am »
I've always liked your blows too.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2019, 12:18:11 am »
 :-*
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Dormant but requires tea
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2019, 09:28:28 am »
I could just read pages 14 & 15 with both eyes. (My right eye is 'normal' and my left is damaged by optic neuritis and has poor colour vision & reduced acuity.)

White on pale does create a lack of contrast, which is suboptimal.

It's kind of handy to have eyes I can use to test some things...
Whereas to me, those pages are white text on dark, but varying shades of dark.

Clearly this is something that needs thinking about but I expect it's difficult to design with colour in a way that it is visually appealing to colour-viewers and legible to colour-non-viewers without having some relevant input. Maybe a colour blind audaxer needs to volunteer to give the pages a once-over before they go to print.
The unwilling rider and the one who leaves each control in turn without reluctance, with no desire to come back, obviously cannot be making the same journey, even though their brevets are identical.

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2019, 09:50:23 am »
It doesn't need thinking about at all - publishers and designers have known and understood the issues with text and backgrounds forever.
It's just a question of whether you go safe (criticised above as 'earthbound') or edgy, and how much.  Personally I think the designer is reaching out to an audience that doesn't quite match AUK's ackowledged demographic.
It's not dark yet but it's getting there.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2019, 12:40:14 pm »
I think frankie has it. Black on white has maximal contrast (why do you think this is used for eye tests?) but seems stuffy and BORING.

At least there are few fancy fonts...

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Arrivee redesign
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2019, 12:51:38 pm »
I think frankie has it. Black on white has maximal contrast (why do you think this is used for eye tests?) but seems stuffy and BORING.

At least there are few fancy fonts...

But white on black is easier for some people to read.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/