Coronavirus and Audax

[Davef]

In the short term specifically for covid-19, exercise that lowers bmi if you are overweight or obese, that lowers blood pressure, reduces stress and improves cardiovascular fitness. This all also improves innate immune response. I would avoid extremes of duration or effort. I would also consider improving diet, reducing alcohol and caffeine.


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[Jaded]

In the short term specifically for covid-19, exercise that lowers bmi if you are overweight or obese, that lowers blood pressure, reduces stress and improves cardiovascular fitness. This all also improves innate immune response. I would avoid extremes of duration or effort. I would also consider improving diet, reducing alcohol and caffeine.


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How quickly would one expect their bmi to be reduced? Days?

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

[TimC]

In the short term specifically for covid-19, exercise that lowers bmi if you are overweight or obese, that lowers blood pressure, reduces stress and improves cardiovascular fitness. This all also improves innate immune response. I would avoid extremes of duration or effort. I would also consider improving diet, reducing alcohol and caffeine.


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How quickly would one expect their bmi to be reduced? Days?

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

I've managed to get my BMI to go up quite significantly in the 24 days since the lockdown started - and that's with no less exercise than normal!

[Jaded]

 

[Davef]

In the short term specifically for covid-19, exercise that lowers bmi if you are overweight or obese, that lowers blood pressure, reduces stress and improves cardiovascular fitness. This all also improves innate immune response. I would avoid extremes of duration or effort. I would also consider improving diet, reducing alcohol and caffeine.


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How quickly would one expect their bmi to be reduced? Days?

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

I am not advocating excessive weight reduction in a few days. 1% per week is considered safe, but possibly less than that. Cardiovascular and innate immune system improvements are measurable after only a matter of days, which I find incredible. It is a couple of months since the virus reached our shores and it will be months or years before normality is returned.

Edit: I see from my post that it might appear that I was saying weight loss was the most important because of the order I listed things. That was not my intention.

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[S2L]

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

Why high stress?
I'm working from home and doing very little, I don't have children to school or elderly parents to worry (too much) about... I am eating home cooked food every meal... I get to do one beautiful bike ride a day on quiet road while nature is in bloom, I've got flowers in my garden and birds coming to the feeder, my chances of getting into contact with the virus are limited to one shopping a week which I do in the evening when it's very quiet...
I don't feel very stressed at all and I have reduced my BMI from 23.5 to 22.5... 
If it wasn't for the death toll and the profound damage to the economy, I'd sign for this lifestyle any day

[simonp]

In the short term specifically for covid-19, exercise that lowers bmi if you are overweight or obese, that lowers blood pressure, reduces stress and improves cardiovascular fitness. This all also improves innate immune response. I would avoid extremes of duration or effort. I would also consider improving diet, reducing alcohol and caffeine.


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I'm happy with doing extremes of intensity. One of the biggest mistakes people make as they get older is avoiding high intensity; it hastens the decline. I've already had a break in training this year due to a lingering cough from a couple of nasty colds in January, and the loss of fitness has been significant. If I dropped my training level for the duration of Covid-19 I'm looking not at a few weeks of reduced training, but up to 18 months. That would have a long term health impact, particularly given I'm middle aged, and will find it harder to get back the longer I am out.

[Jaded]

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

Why high stress?
I'm working from home and doing very little, I don't have children to school or elderly parents to worry (too much) about... I am eating home cooked food every meal... I get to do one beautiful bike ride a day on quiet road while nature is in bloom, I've got flowers in my garden and birds coming to the feeder, my chances of getting into contact with the virus are limited to one shopping a week which I do in the evening when it's very quiet...
I don't feel very stressed at all and I have reduced my BMI from 23.5 to 22.5... 
If it wasn't for the death toll and the profound damage to the economy, I'd sign for this lifestyle any day

"I"

[simonp]

Do let us know when you have something useful to contribute.

[S2L]

Is it sensible in a time of high stress to be advocating excessive weight reduction measures?

Why high stress?
I'm working from home and doing very little, I don't have children to school or elderly parents to worry (too much) about... I am eating home cooked food every meal... I get to do one beautiful bike ride a day on quiet road while nature is in bloom, I've got flowers in my garden and birds coming to the feeder, my chances of getting into contact with the virus are limited to one shopping a week which I do in the evening when it's very quiet...
I don't feel very stressed at all and I have reduced my BMI from 23.5 to 22.5... 
If it wasn't for the death toll and the profound damage to the economy, I'd sign for this lifestyle any day

"I"

Yes, "I"... and I'm not alone... of the 100 or so folks I follow on Strava, all I see is people having a great time... don't see much stress. Should we feel guilty for having it good when times are hard? Do others feel guilty when they have it good and we have it bad? I don't drink, don't go to pubs, hardly ever go to restaurants, very rarely visit friends and my relatives live abroad, so in many ways it is not much different from normal life.

I want this to go away as much as anybody else, but I don't have a magic wand... all I can do is follow the rules, help if any of my neighbours need and do my best to keep my physical and mental health in a good place.

I don't feel guilty and if I sound selfish, then so be it

[Kim]

Yes, "I"... and I'm not alone... of the 100 or so folks I follow on Strava, all I see is people having a great time... don't see much stress.

You're not going to see the stress on Strava, though.  If you look at my feed, you'll just see me riding my bike a lot.  You'd have to be pretty familiar with my habits to tell that I'm opting for 'safe' over 'fun' in my choice of bike and routes, and you still wouldn't be able to tell that my objective changed from being fit for the start of the race season to trying to improve my odds of surviving the virus, or that riding my bike is my primary means of putting the stress on hold for a couple of hours.

I haven't slept properly for weeks.  I'm also losing weight faster since the start of the lockdown; this isn't intentional.

But no, I don't feel guilty.  Well, no more than normal.


ETA: I should also say that this isn't all the pandemic:  I've known that was coming for most of my life and accepted that my odds weren't going to be great, though the awful way it's being handled and the needless danger that I'm seeing friends being put in as a result is new.  But I've been on edge since things took a turn for the nasty in 2016.

[Peter]

@ S2L I didn't take Jaded as suggesting you were being selfish when he said, "I".  I just took it as him meaning that there are other people having an extremely stressful time at the moment, for reasons that you and others don't have.  That's life.  It isn't the same for everyone.  But I didn't see it as blaming.  And I didn't think he was particularly aiming it at an individual.

cross-post with Kim

[S2L]

In other news, this morning I spotted a beautiful Quest Velomobile in Kineton Warwickshire... perfect day for it, with a stiff breeze

[Hot Flatus]

Yus. The sleep thing is a  bastard. If I get through a night without waking for a few hours at about 2am, I'm really chuffed. Being an observer to this crisis is not without stress. Nor is contemplating the future, post-crisis, not least because the future is not at all clear. These last few weeks might prove to have been a golden age of innocence. Or they might not.

[Jaded]

Peter, that's a good summary.

I'm very lucky, where we live and so on. My Mum is self isolating and missing human contact. I remind her that having a garden is way, way preferable to being on floor 18 of an inner city tower block.

We are all in it together, although some much more so than others.

[Greenbank]

Mind boggling. Pretty fucked up that the elderly are being dragooned in to raising money for a public service which should be funded by taxing wealth in the first place.

As has been said in the main Coronavirus thread, it's not for the NHS, but for NHS Charities Together.

The money isn't going into the pot that pays for medical equipment, PPE, salaries, etc.

[S2L]

Did you guys not live through the HIV era?

That was stressful: no cure and not many chances of survival even for perfectly healthy individuals... and that lasted for years, before a drug became available... a vaccine never did, as far as I am aware. Yes, getting it wasn't as easy, but the outcome was far more dire.

[simonp]

Yes, "I"... and I'm not alone... of the 100 or so folks I follow on Strava, all I see is people having a great time... don't see much stress. Should we feel guilty for having it good when times are hard? Do others feel guilty when they have it good and we have it bad? I don't drink, don't go to pubs, hardly ever go to restaurants, very rarely visit friends and my relatives live abroad, so in many ways it is not much different from normal life.

I want this to go away as much as anybody else, but I don't have a magic wand... all I can do is follow the rules, help if any of my neighbours need and do my best to keep my physical and mental health in a good place.

I don't feel guilty and if I sound selfish, then so be it

One thing I've noticed is that people are giving me a lot more Kudos for my indoor training than normal. I've also heard stories about some very poor attitudes towards cyclists in our local area, and indeed a story of someone being pushed off their bike from a passing vehicle, and ending up needing hospital treatment. Our village is on a Sustrans route, and there are comments on the local Facebook about how cyclists passing through can't be local because "they're wearing lycra". These people are dangerous, stirring up hate, and on my *one* outdoor ride I've done recently I did make a point of using the bypass rather than cycling through the village I live in, due to the risk of coming across such ignorant attitudes.

For a country in lockdown, the roads didn't seem as quiet as I'd expected. Most of the drivers gave me far more room than normal, though.

[Hot Flatus]

Peter, that's a good summary.

I'm very lucky, where we live and so on. My Mum is self isolating and missing human contact. I remind her that having a garden is way, way preferable to being on floor 18 of an inner city tower block.

We are all in it together, although some much more so than others.

Well that was the early proclamation from our millionaire, Eton educated overlords.

It is very clear that WFH is the preserve of the middle-class, and that BAME are taking the biggest hit, within the health care sector and without. This crisis has brought inequality right out into the open.

By the way, do we have a Prime Minister?

[bludger]

As has been said in the main Coronavirus thread, it's not for the NHS, but for NHS Charities Together.

The money isn't going into the pot that pays for medical equipment, PPE, salaries, etc.

I know the distinction but it still makes me very uneasy. I feel we are sleepwalking into the NHS being something like the RNLI instead of what it should b, a cast iron and centrally funded public service that doesn't exist at the mercy of charity money.

[Hot Flatus]

Yes, "I"... and I'm not alone... of the 100 or so folks I follow on Strava, all I see is people having a great time... don't see much stress. Should we feel guilty for having it good when times are hard? Do others feel guilty when they have it good and we have it bad? I don't drink, don't go to pubs, hardly ever go to restaurants, very rarely visit friends and my relatives live abroad, so in many ways it is not much different from normal life.

I want this to go away as much as anybody else, but I don't have a magic wand... all I can do is follow the rules, help if any of my neighbours need and do my best to keep my physical and mental health in a good place.

I don't feel guilty and if I sound selfish, then so be it

One thing I've noticed is that people are giving me a lot more Kudos for my indoor training than normal. I've also heard stories about some very poor attitudes towards cyclists in our local area, and indeed a story of someone being pushed off their bike from a passing vehicle, and ending up needing hospital treatment. Our village is on a Sustrans route, and there are comments on the local Facebook about how cyclists passing through can't be local because "they're wearing lycra". These people are dangerous, stirring up hate, and on my *one* outdoor ride I've done recently I did make a point of using the bypass rather than cycling through the village I live in, due to the risk of coming across such ignorant attitudes.

For a country in lockdown, the roads didn't seem as quiet as I'd expected. Most of the drivers gave me far more room than normal, though.

There are lots of angry stupid people in this country, and the crisis hasn't made them any less so. I've noticed that there are fewer vehicles, but ALL of the cunts are still on the roads.

[Greenbank]

As has been said in the main Coronavirus thread, it's not for the NHS, but for NHS Charities Together.

The money isn't going into the pot that pays for medical equipment, PPE, salaries, etc.

I know the distinction but it still makes me very uneasy. I feel we are sleepwalking into the NHS being something like the RNLI instead of what it should b, a cast iron and centrally funded public service that doesn't exist at the mercy of charity money.

Yes, well that's the Tories for you.

NHS Charities Together already raises ~£430m a year, but that's a tiny fraction (0.3%) of last years' NHS budget.

[Kim]

Did you guys not live through the HIV era?

That was stressful: no cure and not many chances of survival even for perfectly healthy individuals... and that lasted for years, before a drug became available... a vaccine never did, as far as I am aware. Yes, getting it wasn't as easy, but the outcome was far more dire.

I was a child, but my father was a medical microbiologist with a special interest in Africa, so I saw it from the scientists' side.  It was only in my teens, as I started to seek out the LGBT community, that I really appreciated the human impact.  I've no idea what it was like from the perspective of an adult who wasn't directly affected, but surrounded by plenty of fear^[1].

The AIDS crisis only 'ended' in the western world, of course.  HIV is still a death sentence for everyone else.


_{[1] I introduced barakta (who missed the 80s on account of being deaf) to the "Don't die of ignorance" film some years ago by way of an experiment.}

[S2L]

Nor is contemplating the future, post-crisis, not least because the future is not at all clear. These last few weeks might prove to have been a golden age of innocence. Or they might not.

I could argue that the recent past sucked on many levels. My parents always told that the 50s were a great time, full of hope for the future and when things were getting better all the time, starting from a very low point.
Maybe we need to be at a lower point to appreciate what we've got a build a different/better future.

What exactly was so great and to be missed about, saying... .2019? Was it the growing threat of climate change, the celebrity culture, the growing inequality, the disregard for the public sector from both politicians and the public, the rampant obesity and diabetes? Was it the Brexit debate in parliament?

I don't miss any of that sxxt...

[Greenbank]

Always a laugh when cycling gets bigged up as some extreme sport.

Here's the media celebrating a 90 year old climbing up and down stairs, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52319318

In 2015 nearly 800 people in the UK were killed falling on stairs https://stairs.bwf.org.uk/jeremy-vine-show-steps-up-to-stair-safety/

I re-read the article. She hopes to complete it over the course of two months, that's 4 or 5 trips up the stairs a day. Doesn't seem much different to normal life so most of those trips up the stairs may be necessary (or at least not "unreasonable") anyway.

What most people miss is that risks with exercise are proportional to duration (or number of iterations). People will often compare someone's utility cycling to the local shops, to their own multi-hour ride and count them both as "cycle rides". There's a reason why mode of transport statistics are calculated per distance and not per trip.