Author Topic: what I have learned today.  (Read 353370 times)

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4000 on: January 11, 2020, 06:12:49 pm »
In Gloucestershire, kecks were underwear.


We'd better not mention knickers!
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orraloon

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4001 on: January 11, 2020, 08:15:20 pm »
In Gloucestershire, kecks were underwear.
And indeed in East Kilbride, though pronounced "kechs".

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4002 on: January 11, 2020, 08:43:43 pm »
I'm not sure if it shares a derivation with "cack".
I do not ride a great big Mercian, gangster tanwalls, fixed cog in the back.

Clare

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4003 on: January 11, 2020, 08:53:18 pm »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.

Giraffe

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4004 on: January 12, 2020, 09:00:39 am »
Only Northants - I was told that back in the '50s* and had always assumed that it was a general term.

*Prolly in the field at the top of Lodge Road, Little Houghton (Hoe_ton, not How_ton!).
2x4: thick plank; 4x4: 2 of 'em.

Salvatore

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4005 on: January 12, 2020, 10:34:36 am »
That the German equivalent of a Friday car is a Montagsauto, the implication being that standards of British* car workers drop when they are looking forward to the weekend, while their German counterparts find it difficult to concentrate immediately after a heavy weekend.

* and American, given the hashtags of the 2nd urban dictionary definition.
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et avec John, excellent lecteur de road-book, on s'en est sortis sans erreur

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4006 on: January 12, 2020, 02:05:02 pm »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.
That's interesting.  I'm from Lincolnshire, and it's keck (for cow parsley) there too - but not heard it anywhere else in the UK. Maybe an East Midlands term?

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4007 on: January 12, 2020, 03:24:22 pm »
The alarm call of a chaffinch.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

Salvatore

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4008 on: January 12, 2020, 03:57:17 pm »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.
That's interesting.  I'm from Lincolnshire, and it's keck (for cow parsley) there too - but not heard it anywhere else in the UK. Maybe an East Midlands term?

The OED has a citation from south Cheshire.

It also occurs in the works of John Clare of Helpston, which is in Northants but within spitting distance of the Lincolnshire border.
Quote
et avec John, excellent lecteur de road-book, on s'en est sortis sans erreur

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4009 on: January 12, 2020, 06:25:09 pm »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.
That's interesting.  I'm from Lincolnshire, and it's keck (for cow parsley) there too - but not heard it anywhere else in the UK. Maybe an East Midlands term?

The OED has a citation from south Cheshire.

It also occurs in the works of John Clare of Helpston, which is in Northants but within spitting distance of the Lincolnshire border.
This is getting spooky.  I live now (and have for 30 years, at the very bottom south end of Cheshire.....).  Cow parsley is cow parsley here, the locals have never heard of "keck".  What's the OED citation say?

Salvatore

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4010 on: January 13, 2020, 09:10:17 am »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.
That's interesting.  I'm from Lincolnshire, and it's keck (for cow parsley) there too - but not heard it anywhere else in the UK. Maybe an East Midlands term?

The OED has a citation from south Cheshire.

It also occurs in the works of John Clare of Helpston, which is in Northants but within spitting distance of the Lincolnshire border.
This is getting spooky.  I live now (and have for 30 years, at the very bottom south end of Cheshire.....).  Cow parsley is cow parsley here, the locals have never heard of "keck".  What's the OED citation say?

It's from "The folk-speech of South Cheshire" by Thomas Darlington published in 1887. "As dry as a keck".
The definition says it refers to "Any of the large Umbelliferæ, or their hollow stems", also that it is "now dialect", implying it was earlier used over a larger area.
Quote
et avec John, excellent lecteur de road-book, on s'en est sortis sans erreur

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4011 on: January 13, 2020, 10:44:24 am »
The Lion The Witch and the Wardrobe - what a magnificent name "Aslan" is. How creative was C S Lewis, eh?

Aslan is Turkish for "lion".

Kim

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4012 on: January 13, 2020, 04:13:32 pm »
The Lion The Witch and the Wardrobe - what a magnificent name "Aslan" is. How creative was C S Lewis, eh?

Aslan is Turkish for "lion".

Wait till you hear about Simba...
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4013 on: January 13, 2020, 04:46:23 pm »
Just how small the IC parts of a current F1 engine are. (We have some parts in our facility at the moment for CT scanning).
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

Basil

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4014 on: January 14, 2020, 11:31:18 am »
From Jim Al-Khalili's 'The Life Scientific' on R4 this morning.
The Tyrannosaurus Rex is closer in time to the iPad than to Stegosaurus.
Quote from: Kim
And remember that friends who organise things on Facebook aren't proper friends anyway.

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4015 on: January 14, 2020, 01:07:39 pm »
Wow. But then again, a couple of people I work with are dinosaurs, so...

Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4016 on: January 14, 2020, 01:27:30 pm »
In Northants keck is another name for cow parsley.
That's interesting.  I'm from Lincolnshire, and it's keck (for cow parsley) there too - but not heard it anywhere else in the UK. Maybe an East Midlands term?

The OED has a citation from south Cheshire.

It also occurs in the works of John Clare of Helpston, which is in Northants but within spitting distance of the Lincolnshire border.
This is getting spooky.  I live now (and have for 30 years, at the very bottom south end of Cheshire.....).  Cow parsley is cow parsley here, the locals have never heard of "keck".  What's the OED citation say?

It's from "The folk-speech of South Cheshire" by Thomas Darlington published in 1887. "As dry as a keck".
The definition says it refers to "Any of the large Umbelliferæ, or their hollow stems", also that it is "now dialect", implying it was earlier used over a larger area.

Thank you Salvatore.  Fascinating.  I'll raise that with the village historian next time I see him - he'll no doubt either have that book or know where to borrow one.  The term has definitely fallen out of use here in Cheshire - but I'll ask my old farmer neighbour next time I see him, but it's still in common use in Lincolnshire. 

FifeingEejit

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4017 on: January 14, 2020, 01:34:55 pm »
The Lion The Witch and the Wardrobe - what a magnificent name "Aslan" is. How creative was C S Lewis, eh?

Aslan is Turkish for "lion".

Wait till you hear about Simba...
One of our serves is called Shenzi, given its running an ancient version of Solaris it could be a good description of the heighheedyin responsible for it.

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Mr Larrington

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4018 on: January 14, 2020, 09:39:22 pm »
I have started watching Tony Palmer's epic 17-part history of popular music "All You Need Is Love" and have thus learned that Hoagy Carmichael was a white man from Indianapolis :o
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4019 on: January 15, 2020, 09:06:32 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51105056

"The issue of hyphens gets more complex when someone joins the House of Lords, with peerage rules demanding a double surname be hyphenated (so it's Andrew Lloyd Webber but Lord Lloyd-Webber, and Martha Lane Fox but Baroness Lane-Fox)."

T42

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4020 on: January 15, 2020, 10:47:26 am »
Elohim is plural, so in the beginning gods created heaven and earth.  Or is that the editorial we at work?
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

Salvatore

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4021 on: January 15, 2020, 10:54:25 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51105056

"The issue of hyphens gets more complex when someone joins the House of Lords, with peerage rules demanding a double surname be hyphenated (so it's Andrew Lloyd Webber but Lord Lloyd-Webber, and Martha Lane Fox but Baroness Lane-Fox)."

Hyphenated names: I have from time to time wondered why Terry-Thomas (born Thomas Terry Hoar Stevens) had a hyphenated stage name. Prompted by Legs' post, I did a bit of delving.

During this period, he billed himself as Thomas (or Thos) Stevens, but reorganised the name to its backward spelling of Mot Snevets; the name did not last long and he changed it to Thomas Terry. He soon realised that people were mistaking him as a relative of Dame Ellen Terry, so inverted the name to Terry Thomas. He did not add the hyphen until 1947, and later explained that it was "not for snob reasons but to tie the two names together. They didn't mean much apart; together they made a trade name": the hyphen was also "to match the gap in his front teeth" from https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Terry-Thomas
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et avec John, excellent lecteur de road-book, on s'en est sortis sans erreur

barakta

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4022 on: January 16, 2020, 12:40:19 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51105056

"The issue of hyphens gets more complex when someone joins the House of Lords, with peerage rules demanding a double surname be hyphenated (so it's Andrew Lloyd Webber but Lord Lloyd-Webber, and Martha Lane Fox but Baroness Lane-Fox)."

Peerage rules are stupid and wrong. If there's no hyphen, putting one in is inaccurate.

I have a friend who intentionally gave his daughter a two word forename to break databases so he could be pedantic at them... Little bobby tables and all that... I bet she changes it when she turns 18 tho.

Auntie Helen

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Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4023 on: January 16, 2020, 05:22:27 am »
Elohim is plural, so in the beginning gods created heaven and earth.  Or is that the editorial we at work?
I think it‘s thought to be like the Royal We.
My blog on cycling in Germany and eating German cake – http://www.auntiehelen.co.uk


Re: what I have learned today.
« Reply #4024 on: January 16, 2020, 08:37:35 am »
Elohim is plural, so in the beginning gods created heaven and earth.  Or is that the editorial we at work?
I think it‘s thought to be like the Royal We.

For the optional names see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Judaism

and for the specific explanation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Judaism#Elohim

And if you think there is a simple explanation, have a look at a "basic" bible page in the form as would be typically used for study.


The big writing top right is the start of the first sentence. The dots around the letters are both vowels and punctuation (more on that later).

The left hand first line is the "Translation of Onklos", Onklos was a Rabbi who translated the bible into some form of Aramaic, and is one of the first recorded bible translations. There is a fundamental principle in jewish teaching that says Anyone Who Went Before Is Cleverer And Beterer That We Are, so this is worthy of study in its own right. Given it's pigeon aramaic written in hebrew characters one has to wonder, but hey ho.

Underneath that on the two column layout is the explanation by Rashi, who lived in Troyes in the 11th Century, who took a basic explanatory approach to his commentary. So much so that there are tracts after tracts, book after book, written on arguments about what he meant. Given that (apart from Onklos) he is one of the early written commentators (I'm excluding the Talmud here, on which he also provided a commentary) he Cannot Be Wrong. Oh yes, did I mention it's written in a completely different version of the Hebrew alphabet? And, as iis common, without vowels. Given that vowels can change the meaning of a word, and this is meant to be an explanation, you do have to wonder.

Next down we're into the Spanish Influence.

Ibn Ezra is the left hand column, Spanish, 12th Century.

Then we get to Ramban (right hand column) an interesting character of the 13th century who was significant in Spain. (not to be confused with Rambam of a similar period who was big in the Spanish Court)

The next block is "The Explanation of Ibn Ezra". Ibn Ezra, who Went Before and therefore Knows More Than Us didn't really explain himself well enough. He needed someone (can't remember who, but they Went Before, too) to explain what he said.

Last - but certainly not least - is Siforno again Spanish, 16th century.

We haven't got out of either the first century (error) sentence or the 16th century by this time.

Anyhow, back to the punctuation. This is interesting in many ways because it is also used as the notation for the chanting when sung out loud in the synagogue, and apart from providing another source of challenge for boys going through Bar-Mitzvah (where traditionally (?) they take the place of the cantor or rabbi for the reading of their portion of the scroll) also provides additional fodder for commentary. In the sentence concerned there is an effective comma: In the beginning god created, the heaven and the earth.

Only, you guessed it, it isn't quite so simple.

First, "the heaven and the earth" - the actual way to say that would be ha'shamayim ve ha'aretz. Only, there is an additional "ess" with both: ess ha'shamayim veess ha'aretz. "Ess" actually has a connotation of "with".

Second, the bit before the comma could as easily be translated "The beginning created god". What is actually certain is the "In the beginning god created" is not very accurate. It's an awkward sentence - see the extent of commentary on the page.

So, let's put those together: "The beginning created god, with the heaven and with the earth"

There you go, Big Bang theory, in the bible.