Author Topic: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?  (Read 15530 times)

mattc

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Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2010, 11:45:12 am »
But presumably they originally chose 26 because that was how long the route round the parts of london they wanted to route it round were originally, and then it has stuck and is the yardstick for any marathon wherever.
Yeah, and then the Greeks* stole the idea ...

Back to riding 100s:
You're right, I do suffer lack of motivation to ride 100s now. But there's a subtlety to this:
by riding them and getting validated you're boosting the organiser's figures on AUKweb, so there is (kind of) some point!

So ....
If something like RRTY** was on the line, I'd choose the 200. But generally I'd ride out to the nice 100 Calendar event, mainly for the company etc.
(**for others, substitute seasonal points target, AAA points, an SR etc ... etc ... !)

(*Spartans? Oh who cares ... )
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2010, 11:46:50 am »
I don't see a problem with the concept of 'validation' but perhaps we could question how validation occurs.

AUK is quite centralised as a national body leading to a small number of people spending an enormous amount of time volunteering their free-time on a regulatory activities (please don't take that as a negative criticism of their sterling efforts).  A more productive process of validation could be achieved on a devolved basis, say by calendar event organisers validating their participants.  This would free up time for AUK to promote and market audaxe's other tangible benefits as a cycling activity.  

Central validation could not be dispensed with in a number of other areas such as DIYs. Quite where permanents fit would require further thought.

The Brevet Card is a rather outmoded method of providing validatory evidence. Individual organisers could be given the discretion to use electronic methods as used on sportives.  Danial Webb has partially led the way through his experimentation with GPX files for audaxes.  

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2010, 11:51:19 am »
As I understand it, most of what you suggest is already in place Philip. I'm pretty sure most 200s are validated by the organisers now, and Danial is plowing ahead with the GPX validation, however this isn't a solution for all as not everyone has, wants or can afford a GPS.

BRM makes things trickier though as everything has to be validated by ACP too.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

marcus

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #28 on: May 20, 2010, 12:08:26 pm »
For me, validation provides a framework that gets me out on the bike. Yes the only person who cares is me, but I can set myself goals (n points in a season; an SR Series; try to get round in under nn hours) and being a bloke, I'm target/metric driven - so it all helps.

That's very different from being competitive in an event - I tend to roll along at my own pace and I'd be very put off by any overt element of placings or rankings.  Maybe if I were faster that would be different, of course :)

This is exactly how I feel. Having a target for the season acts as a powerful motivator for me, and of course you get a real sense of acheivement when/if you meet your target.

The last couple of years' audaxing has brought home to me just how much I am driven by personal targets. In 2008 I set myself a target for gaining AAA points & this really helped get me out of bed in the mornings. Last year I didn't set myself any targets, just thought I would ride as and when I felt like it, and the result was I found it very difficult to motivate myself to ride audaxes, especially the longer ones, and I felt vaguely unfulfilled at the end of the season.

As MV says, I think some of it is a bloke thing!

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2010, 01:00:50 pm »
... and being a bloke, I'm target/metric driven

Does this mean that if we measured events in miles, we'd get more laydeez riding?

IGMC ...
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2010, 01:10:41 pm »
. . . .  or listing all their events in their signature like it's a DSO and bar.  ;D


BTW  - I'm one of those that does that - but I never saw it as bragging. Just a social thing really. Means that people know what rides I'm doing and when we are likely to meet up.

Same here - and I like seeing it in other people's sigs as it often prompts me to enter a ride that I'd missed on the calendar (or not realised had crept up so fast).

fboab

  • It's a fecking serious business, riding a bike
Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2010, 01:11:53 pm »
<checks frontage> it's not just a bloke thing. :-[ I ride 100s with my boy. It would be harder to motivate myself to do that if I wasn't picking up FWC points too, but I've probably enjoyed those rides most.
I think I'm going to have to admit I wouldn't find it as motivating if I wasn't comparing points against other people. I want to advertise I've got <n> points.
I am clearly a bad competitive person.
TSS is not Total Sex Score, Chris!

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2010, 01:51:19 pm »
It's not a bloke thing.
I enjoyed collecting badges and medals.
I achieved way beyond anything I thought I could do.
It was great to have proof of what I'd done and it's nice to have the souvenirs now i can't ride.

vorsprung

  • Opposites Attract
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Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2010, 01:53:55 pm »

Back to riding 100s:
You're right, I do suffer lack of motivation to ride 100s now.

Me too.  I have to enter the event and get  to the start on time.  Then all I get to do is a measly 100km.  Just get warmed up and ...it's over
The Dartmoor Devil is the exception that proves the rule
Audaxing Blog follow @vorsprungbike on

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2010, 02:15:44 pm »

Back to riding 100s:
You're right, I do suffer lack of motivation to ride 100s now.

Me too.  I have to enter the event and get  to the start on time.  Then all I get to do is a measly 100km.  Just get warmed up and ...it's over
The Dartmoor Devil is the exception that proves the rule

Obviously for experienced riders 100s need a hook to be worthwhile; very scenic (in either sense of the word) or very sociable (ridden with my son or friends) do it for me - but not very often now.

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2010, 04:57:32 pm »
For me, validation provides a framework that gets me out on the bike. Yes the only person who cares is me, but I can set myself goals (n points in a season; an SR Series; try to get round in under nn hours) and being a bloke, I'm target/metric driven - so it all helps.

That's very different from being competitive in an event - I tend to roll along at my own pace and I'd be very put off by any overt element of placings or rankings.  Maybe if I were faster that would be different, of course :)

Yep, that about sums it up for me. It's all about personal goals.

I do enter all my rides in bikejournal and have been getting slightly obsessed with climbing up the rankings, but that's just another motivational tool to persuade me to get out on the bike and not be lazy - I'm chasing perpetual dan in the yacf league, but not because I want to "beat" him, just because he's a handy target to aim for.

This "competitive" element has helped me lose nearly half a stone so far this year. Therefore, I am definitely the "winner".

d.

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2010, 06:13:53 pm »

In other words, are you happy not to prove you've done the ride to anyone else but yourself.


Yes. Even with the current system I'd be very surprised if anyone but me knows how many points I've got anyway.

But I do like to see what other's have got. It's interesting to see how  much other people ride and has probably motivated me to ride more this year but I'm not competing with anyone.

And I like the self-validation of Audax rides: I have a sore arse, therefore I am

Salvatore

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Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2010, 10:15:54 pm »

1. I ride a 300k start @ 6.00am
...
2. I ride a 300k and finish just within the time limit @ 3.00am.

Timing is everything.


If it's a 6.00am start you're an hour outside the time limit.

Very poor timing.
Quote
et avec John, excellent lecteur de road-book, on s'en est sortis sans erreur

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2010, 10:26:32 pm »
I've finished a 6am start 300km Audax at 3:45am and been inside the time limit.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #39 on: May 22, 2010, 07:34:53 am »
Although I got the cards from Daniel, I have not validated any of my DIY 200s. 
I know I did them.  I don't really need any points to tell me that I can or to help me remember that I did.
I don't need to see my name in the little book either.
TBH, I'd rather get points for stupid miles commuting every day, year in year out.
That is much harder than pushing out a 200k ride.

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #40 on: May 22, 2010, 08:37:13 am »
Same here.  I'm doing 3 x 300's next week (London-Scotland) but I can't be bothered to try and claim points.  I want to take the nicest route and at the times that suit me, and not have all the faff of getting the route approved, buying a bottle of water for over £1 just to get a receipt, etc.  Maybe I'm not a proper audaxer.

Trouble is, I want to do PBP next year.

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #41 on: May 22, 2010, 08:41:58 am »
Same here.  I'm doing 3 x 300's next week (London-Scotland)

Lunan Bay? 

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #42 on: May 22, 2010, 08:48:20 am »
Same here.  I'm doing 3 x 300's next week (London-Scotland)

Lunan Bay? 

Indeed!  How did you guess?

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #43 on: May 22, 2010, 08:56:17 am »
Same here.  I'm doing 3 x 300's next week (London-Scotland)

Lunan Bay? 

Indeed!  How did you guess?

I have 'powers'  :demon: ;D and a good memory  :thumbsup: 8)

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #44 on: May 22, 2010, 09:02:10 am »
I have 'powers'  :demon: ;D and a good memory  :thumbsup: 8)


I'm amazed   :o  ...and impressed  :thumbsup:

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #45 on: May 22, 2010, 10:55:32 am »
I don't really need any points to tell me that I can or to help me remember that I did.
I don't need to see my name in the little book either.


But you log everything on bikejournal - its the same thing isn't it. One just relies on your honesty.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #46 on: May 22, 2010, 12:21:55 pm »
Grub thinks more of his fans will see his miles on BikeJournal than AukWeb.  ;)
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #47 on: May 22, 2010, 02:51:44 pm »
I don't really need any points to tell me that I can or to help me remember that I did.
I don't need to see my name in the little book either.


But you log everything on bikejournal - its the same thing isn't it. One just relies on your honesty.

Miles is not the same as points though.  I don't get points for those miles either.
So I am not sure how it is the same?
I log on Bikejournal because I am an obsessive compulsive when it comes to competitiveness  ;D

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #48 on: May 22, 2010, 02:52:28 pm »
Grub thinks more of his fans will see his miles on BikeJournal than AukWeb.  ;)

Fans?  You're having a larf  ;D

Re: If audax isn't competitive, then why bother with validation at all?
« Reply #49 on: May 22, 2010, 03:37:33 pm »

I log on Bikejournal because I am an obsessive compulsive when it comes to competitiveness  ;D

That reminds me - must log that 1km ride to the video shop.