Author Topic: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?  (Read 2978 times)

ian

  • feat. Undead Jess & Finestre, Queen of Hell
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2020, 11:02:25 am »
I've never tried kefir. I'm not opposed to fizzy milk (I like colorado bulldogs, after all, and ice cream floats – I used to work at a university with proper dairy bar, good god I was so fat) so I might. Kombucha is fine. I'm pretty sure they bung half a tonne of sugar into many of these, so they're basically a standard soft drink with a pretend leanings towards being healthy.

We all love fermented stuff (bread, beer, kimchi, etc.)

Gut microbiomes are important, but I don't think you can specifically feed them, other than via a faecal transplant (there's fairly sound body of work on banking your poo, so you can reboot your gut flora after any course of antibiotics, though be wary when reaching into your freezer...) Even then, the stuff that lives in your colon is going to be very different to what lives in your small intestine, your duodenum, etc.

The gut microbiome is undoubtedly important (perhaps some of the claims are over-inflated, but I think it's vital for creating an effective, and not over-reacting, immune system), but it should look after itself if you eat the usual varied and healthy diet, and apparently it can shift quite quickly. That's why eating something new can give you the seismic farts, but after a couple of times, you're back in gentle tooting territory, but there's no way I'm eating Jerusalem artichoke again to test this theory.

Anyway the microbes in these probiotic drinks are very different to the ones in your gut anyway, so even if they got to where they need to be, they'd be bullied into nonexistence by the locals. It's only recently we've started to get an idea that lives down there, metagenomics is a product of fourth gen sequencers* and computational grunt. Anyway, it's a complex ecosystem of bacteria, archaea, protists, yeasts, and viruses, and probably some bigger parasites. Before metagenomics people had to try and identify them by growing them in the lab, but the majority of them can't be grown outside the gut. There are more microbial cells in our gut than there are human cells in our body.

*back when I sequenced DNA, I had to climb a ladder, now you have these. I am quite tempted to buy one just because.
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zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2020, 12:31:55 pm »
roasted potato chips and kefir was one of our staples when i was a student. i like the taste (not all of them taste good btw), and it is refreshing in hot summer weather. haven't had kefir in ages now and almost feel like going to the shop and getting some!

Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2020, 06:45:59 pm »
I've never tried kefir. I'm not opposed to fizzy milk (I like colorado bulldogs, after all, and ice cream floats – I used to work at a university with proper dairy bar, good god I was so fat) so I might. Kombucha is fine. I'm pretty sure they bung half a tonne of sugar into many of these, so they're basically a standard soft drink with a pretend leanings towards being healthy.

We all love fermented stuff (bread, beer, kimchi, etc.)

Gut microbiomes are important, but I don't think you can specifically feed them, other than via a faecal transplant (there's fairly sound body of work on banking your poo, so you can reboot your gut flora after any course of antibiotics, though be wary when reaching into your freezer...) Even then, the stuff that lives in your colon is going to be very different to what lives in your small intestine, your duodenum, etc.

The gut microbiome is undoubtedly important (perhaps some of the claims are over-inflated, but I think it's vital for creating an effective, and not over-reacting, immune system), but it should look after itself if you eat the usual varied and healthy diet, and apparently it can shift quite quickly. That's why eating something new can give you the seismic farts, but after a couple of times, you're back in gentle tooting territory, but there's no way I'm eating Jerusalem artichoke again to test this theory.

Anyway the microbes in these probiotic drinks are very different to the ones in your gut anyway, so even if they got to where they need to be, they'd be bullied into nonexistence by the locals. It's only recently we've started to get an idea that lives down there, metagenomics is a product of fourth gen sequencers* and computational grunt. Anyway, it's a complex ecosystem of bacteria, archaea, protists, yeasts, and viruses, and probably some bigger parasites. Before metagenomics people had to try and identify them by growing them in the lab, but the majority of them can't be grown outside the gut. There are more microbial cells in our gut than there are human cells in our body.

*back when I sequenced DNA, I had to climb a ladder, now you have these. I am quite tempted to buy one just because.

We have a bed of Jerusalem Fartichokes at the allotment. I confirm that we are usually less blowy by Christmas and absolutely fine by Feb (when their finished)

Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #28 on: July 30, 2020, 07:18:12 pm »
Jerusalem Artichokes? Finished? Bwah hahahahahhahahaha!*

Just FTR, certain people of my acquaintance (asking for a friend, obv) have been known to have exceptionally pungent flatulence from time to time, a glass of kefir daily (99p/litre from the Polish shop) appears to help. So I am told.


*For those not aware, Jerusalem artichokes cannot be got rid of once you have planted them.

ian

  • feat. Undead Jess & Finestre, Queen of Hell
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #29 on: July 30, 2020, 09:05:19 pm »
Jerusalem artichokes don't just make me fart explosively, that's the mild symptom, they genuinely made me feel like I was going to explode. I was convinced I was visibly inflating. I couldn't fart fast enough and I was already basically pumping out gas in a continuous stream like I'd been turned into an unwilling rocket engine. It's not an experience I have any wish to repeat. Celeriac comes a close second.

I think they both contain inulin. Nothing good comes of this carbohydrate.
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citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #30 on: July 30, 2020, 09:17:38 pm »
Inulin is another thing people take as a supplement, supposedly as a “prebiotic”, ie something that feeds the microbes in your gut.

Wouldn’t want to share a lift with those people.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

ian

  • feat. Undead Jess & Finestre, Queen of Hell
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #31 on: July 30, 2020, 09:24:40 pm »
Given my experience, I wouldn't want to share the same county with those people.

It was like an episode of the Haribo sugar-free gummy bears saga.
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Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #32 on: July 30, 2020, 10:15:14 pm »
I'm tempted to try Jerusalem artichokes now for science. But I already fart more than enough. Maybe it'll be kill or cure for my gut problems though  ???
Miles cycled 2014 = 3551.5 (Target 7300 :()
Miles cycled 2013 = 6141.4
Miles cycled 2012 = 4038.1

Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #33 on: July 30, 2020, 11:28:39 pm »
Jerusalem Artichokes? Finished? Bwah hahahahahhahahaha!*

...


*For those not aware, Jerusalem artichokes cannot be got rid of once you have planted them.


This is true - the crop gets bigger (and better?) every year. I usually plant a few from the previous year, but it’s just a free for all once summer arrives. The heavy laggy clay is no problem for them and they seem to outcompete all the weeds. It doesn’t do any harm that at 6-10 get tall they get the sum earlier I think.

Ian, it certainly makes the nights interesting. Not sure I’d use inulin as a supplement, other than to precondition for said vegetables.

Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #34 on: July 30, 2020, 11:29:23 pm »
I'm tempted to try Jerusalem artichokes now for science. But I already fart more than enough. Maybe it'll be kill or cure for my gut problems though  ???

Remind me and I’ll send you some for Christmas.

ian

  • feat. Undead Jess & Finestre, Queen of Hell
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #35 on: July 31, 2020, 09:39:39 am »
I'm tempted to try Jerusalem artichokes now for science. But I already fart more than enough. Maybe it'll be kill or cure for my gut problems though  ???

You may also simply take off a like a rocket. Or messily expire there and then in a rapidly expanding cloud of your body parts.

I'd recommend googling 'Haribo Sugar Free' and take some of the stories you find as a cautionary tales.

And honestly, maybe the suffering might be worth it if they tasted great, but really they're a bit meh.
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citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #36 on: July 31, 2020, 09:46:34 am »
'Sugar free' is your guarantee of disappointment.

On a recent episode of Bake Off: The Professionals, one of the challenges was making sweets. The results looked a lot better than Haribo anyway. Tempted to try making my own and putting ALL THE SUGAR in them.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #37 on: July 31, 2020, 10:03:04 am »
Bit late to this, but I homemake my own kefir, which I share with the dog!   I also make my own yoghurt, Greek and natural.  My yoghurt culture has been going about 4 years, kefir about a year.   Both are easy to make and delicious.   

ian

  • feat. Undead Jess & Finestre, Queen of Hell
Re: Kefir the wonder food. True or False?
« Reply #38 on: July 31, 2020, 10:13:29 am »
Most sugar-free isn't sugar-free, they've replaced the sugar with a sugar-alcohol (sorbitol, xylitol, mannitol, erythritol etc.) These are sweet but not as sweet but don't get converted to acid in the mouth, so don't cause tooth decay. Hence the popularity in sweets and chewing gum.

They're not calorie-free, but they're difficult for everything to absorb (us and your gut flora) because while they look like sugars, they're not, so they offer effectively fewer calories and a lower glycaemic index. Bacteria that can make better use of these chemicals will, of course, make the most of the influx which may throw things out of a balance. Which is why you start to guff like a leaky gas main. Also, in large quantities, because they're slow to be absorbed, they result in osmotic diarrhoea (basically, they make it difficult for your gut absorb water, so it squirts out the back end). That's why they're usually used in products that you'd consume in smaller amounts, but if you eat a whole kilo bag, all bets are off. Make sure you're close to a toilet.
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