Author Topic: Sleep  (Read 9398 times)

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Sleep
« on: December 18, 2014, 09:56:33 am »
I have real problems with sleep.

I'm not insomniac - every so often I have something troubling my brain which keeps me awake, but it's too infrequent to be called a problem. My problem is that I'm permanently tired and always ready to nod off. The night just gone is an extreme case, but Mrs. Wow went to bed at about 10.30 last night. I was very tired and went to sleep in my chair. I was well away. At around midnight, Dez also decided to retire and turned the light out, forgetting I was still there, and this woke me up enough for me to go to bed.

Our bedroom is a bit colder than the downstairs room where we always sit. That's not very warm - 20°C or so, usually a bit less - but I like a cool, well-ventilated bedroom. I think this tends to wake me up a bit to start with, but it wasn't that long before I was asleep again. I awoke at 5.30am (bowel o'clock) but from about 5.45 I was fast asleep again, waking a couple of times as Mrs. Wow stirred, but going back to sleep once again. At about 9 am I decided enough was enough.

Now I feel more tired than I did before I went to bed. I reckon I had at least 7 hours' sleep in bed, and at least an hour in the chair beforehand, and when I get the chance I have a nap in the afternoon as well. It's a damned nuisance. It could be a side effect of rheumatoid arthritis - I understand that that makes you sleep more than normal - but whatever it is, I find it a right pain.

Anyone else have really annoying sleep patterns?
Oh, Bach without any doubt. Bach every time for me.

tiermat

  • According to Jane, I'm a Unisex SpaceAdmin
Re: Sleep
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2014, 10:00:40 am »
My sleep patterns are completely fucked up at the moment, due to the oral steriods I am taking. No matter what time I go to bed I am wide awake at 04:00, home or away.

It is really starting to piss me off.
I feel like Captain Kirk, on a brand new planet every day, a little like King Kong on top of the Empire State

Re: Sleep
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2014, 10:04:42 am »
Steroids - I believe you are both taking them.

I'm taking cinnarazine before I go to bed, because if I don't then vertigo attacks give me a very disturbed night. Trouble is, the cinnarazine makes me a bit dopy during the day. Can't think straight.

<i>Marmite slave</i>

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Sleep
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2014, 10:16:06 am »
I'm not on steroids.

Methotrexate isn't a steroid - at least, so far as I know. It's a nasty drug with a fair number of potential side-effects, but it's used as an immunosuppressant when prescribed for rheumatoid arthritis.

Folic acid - to protect the bone marrow from the long-term effects of methotrexate.

Alendronic acid - to stimulate the osteoplasts as a counter to osteoporosis.

Calcichew - a source of calcium for the osteoplasts to work on.

That's the lot, doctor.
Oh, Bach without any doubt. Bach every time for me.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Sleep
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2014, 12:03:10 pm »
I know little about sleep apnea but wonder if that's a component of your trouble...


Re: Sleep
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2014, 12:38:02 pm »
Ah yes, a friend suffered from sleep apnea. I remember him telling the story of the monitoring and then the OH! THAT EXPLAINS IT THEN! when he got the results. Apparently he was stopping breathing every $Very_Short_Time all through the night and incredibly knackered every day as a result.

Also in the spirit of widgets, have you come across those smartphone apps that claim to monitor your sleep patterns and then wake you at a suitable point in your sleep cycle? No idea if they're any use, but I reckon you'd get some satisfaction out of knowing you were at least accumulating data :)

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

  • Miles eaten don't satisfy hunger
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Re: Sleep
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2014, 12:47:31 pm »
My sleep patterns are the opposite.  I struggle to sleep much after 5am these days and feel tired a lot of the time.  My sleep is often worse during the SAD months but I've countered that by cutting out alcohol from when the clocks go back to Easter (with a break for Christmas 25 - 31).  Part of it may be a reasonably high caffeine intake (2x coffee, 3 x tea) per day, but I now require caffeine to concentrate. 

Eddington Numbers 125 (imperial), 168 (metric) 518 (furlongs)  111 (nautical miles)

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Sleep
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2014, 01:26:31 pm »
<pedant> I hope CET puts his clocks FORWARD at Easter.

Caffeine has a long half-life and those sensitive to it should avoid after 6pm and not exceed the equivalent of 5 cups of coffee/tea per day at any time.

Ruthie

  • Her Majester
Re: Sleep
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2014, 06:06:22 pm »
I'm not on steroids.

Methotrexate isn't a steroid - at least, so far as I know. It's a nasty drug with a fair number of potential side-effects, but it's used as an immunosuppressant when prescribed for rheumatoid arthritis.

Folic acid - to protect the bone marrow from the long-term effects of methotrexate.

Alendronic acid - to stimulate the osteoplasts as a counter to osteoporosis.

Calcichew - a source of calcium for the osteoplasts to work on.

That's the lot, doctor.

What Helly said.  It may well be getting a referral to a sleep clinic to be assessed for sleep apnoea.  It's worth a try, Shirley?

Milk please, no sugar.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2014, 06:34:57 pm »
cutting out alcohol from when the clocks go back to Easter (with a break for Christmas 25 - 31). 

<pedant> I hope CET puts his clocks FORWARD at Easter.

<out-pedant>
I'm sure he does: he cuts out booze from when the clocks go back until Easter.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2014, 07:11:34 pm »
Wow - I use a Fitbit One for counting steps. One of its other party tricks is to monitor sleep quality - presumably by measuring restlessness. If you set it to "sensitive" setting, it gives a pretty good reflection of your restlessness - and I'm betting there's a decent match with any apnoea episodes.

They're only about £70 - and might be some kind of alternative if you're confronted with the NHS "Sometime in July" kind of wait.

ETA: Edited to correct for the (frankly) fucking ridiculous spelling of apnoea.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2014, 07:13:13 pm »
I discovered that I had sleep apnoea driving, when I fell asleep at a traffic light. In my case it turned out to be one of my nasal passages was completely blocked necessitating reaming out (there may have been a more technical and medical description). Are you snoring? it might be as simple as that,  it has to be worth trying the "Breathe Easy" strips that open your nasal passages, very easy to sleep with, if you notice any improvement it signifies a direction.


Ruthie

  • Her Majester
Re: Sleep
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2014, 07:20:17 pm »
Wow - I use a Fitbit One for counting steps. One of its other party tricks is to monitor sleep quality - presumably by measuring restlessness. If you set it to "sensitive" setting, it gives a pretty good reflection of your restlessness - and I'm betting there's a decent match with any Apnea episodes.

They're only about £70 - and might be some kind of alternative if you're confronted with the NHS "Sometime in July" kind of wait.

Apnoea just looks like someone not breathing in after they've breathed out.  Usually an apnoeic episode is followed by a massive snore, but no restlessness per se. 

Sleep studies FTW.

Milk please, no sugar.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2014, 07:25:53 pm »

Re: Sleep
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2014, 07:30:37 pm »
If YACF camping trips are anything to go by, I think we may have several candidates for sleep apnoea...


Do we have any data on how well Mrs Wow sleeps?!

barakta

  • Bastard lovechild of Yomiko Readman and Johnny 5
Re: Sleep
« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2014, 09:27:16 pm »
My dad and his wife both have sleep apnoea and both have pap machines which have improved their sleep and therefore lives massively. 

Wow, I would mention your sleep concerns to your medics as it could be your RA or it could be other stuff which is worth eliminating.  They may also have ideasTM. A lot of my students with RA (and other auto immune conditions) mention not feeling refreshed after sleep as a common impact.

Vince

  • Can't climb; won't climb
Re: Sleep
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2014, 09:39:42 pm »
If YACF camping trips are anything to go by, I think we may have several candidates for sleep apnoea...


Do we have any data on how well Mrs Wow sleeps?!

I sleep much better when camping. Mainly because Mrs Wunja doesn't wake me up to tell me I'm snoring.
216km from Marsh Gibbon

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Sleep
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2014, 05:31:38 am »
Thanks for the replies, one and all. I will be following this up next week. I'm currently having a bout of insomnia in Maidstone. This bedroom is much too hot for me, even though the window is open. The fact that the window is open means that I can hear a song thrush with an unseasonal burst of testosterone and I was also disturbed by the 5.15 or whatever time it was in Maidstone West.
Oh, Bach without any doubt. Bach every time for me.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2014, 09:50:11 am »
Google "Lettuce sandwich insomnia".

LEE

  • "Shut Up Jens" - Legs.
Re: Sleep
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2014, 10:12:18 am »
Thanks for the replies, one and all. I will be following this up next week. I'm currently having a bout of insomnia in Maidstone. This bedroom is much too hot for me, even though the window is open. The fact that the window is open means that I can hear a song thrush with an unseasonal burst of testosterone and I was also disturbed by the 5.15 or whatever time it was in Maidstone West.

When you can't sleep then everything is a disruption.  The pillow isn't quite soft enough, the blankets are a bit heavy on your feet, the clock is ticking too loudly.

I went through a spell of it a few years back, when i was at my heaviest ever (maybe coincidental) .

I read some advice that, although breathtakingly simple, bordering on stupid perhaps, seemed to work.

1) Never have naps during the day
My Father in Law seems to pride himself on not needing much sleep but the old bugger falls asleep in front of the TV about 10 times a day.  Most films are a total puzzle to him.
Hardly surprising he wakes up early, he gets a decent sleep during the day.

2) Don't try to go to sleep...try to stay awake.
If I refuse to go to sleep, by reading and reading, then more often than not I'd wake up, with the book on my face after a good night's sleep.

Kindle Paperwhite is perfect for this as it doesn't disturb your partner.

Some people say I'm self-obsessed but that's enough about them.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #20 on: December 20, 2014, 04:19:51 pm »
There are some excellent sleep tapes available if you do some searching. Paul McKenna is very good and if you can find it Dee Buchanan is also excellent. When I had a pretty stressful job offshore they got me off to sleep more times than I like to remember.

PH
Bees do nothing invariably.

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Sleep
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2018, 04:26:42 pm »
OK, rather belatedly, perhaps, I have been diag-nosed with sleep apnoea. Some months ago I wore a thingy on my finger to test oxygen levels. According to the results, the consultant told me that during the night in question I woke up some 60 times during a 7-hour spell in bed. he also said that I was a "fidget". No wonder I wake up tired!

I have to go to another clinic in 6-8 weeks to be fitted and trained in the use of an oxygenating machine that will allow me to sleep better. I think this machine is mains-only so I doubt that I will be taking it to Pembrokeshire, even assuming I have it fitted by then.
Oh, Bach without any doubt. Bach every time for me.

MikeFromLFE

  • Previously known as Millimole
Re: Sleep
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2018, 09:06:04 pm »
I haven't a clue what's changed in the last fortnight, but after several years of being unable to fall asleep, and waking up feeling dreadful - I've recently been dropping off straight away and waking up bright as a button at about 7:30.
I just need to bottle it, whatever it is, in case I lose the recipe.

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Too many angry people - breathe & relax.

Re: Sleep
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2018, 09:29:20 pm »
Wonderful! Bottle lots and lots and lots of it!

ElyDave

  • Royal and Ancient Polar Bear Society member 263583
Re: Sleep
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2018, 12:10:08 am »
well, considering I was up at 6 as usual, adn I'm still here now, my current bout of insomnia is not resolved.

Last night I went to bed about midnight and lay there with my mind wandering. 

Apnoea, I'm not sure, I'm not the classic candidate for it at <70kg and 1.75m, and I don't have the symptoms of day time napping (although I did have a ten minute snooze after my post lunch coffee today).  I just don't seem to be tiring myself routinely.
“Procrastination is the thief of time, collar him.” –Charles Dickens