Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => Audax => Topic started by: LEE on 03 April, 2008, 04:34:30 pm
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So far my max ride is 300km and I've got by with a Barley Saddlebag for my waterproof jacket, overshoes, spare base layer, tubes and toolkit.
I used a barbag for valuables and easy to access snacks.
Those who have ridden 600s seem to carry a wide range of 'extras' including Space Blankets, Bivvy Bags, changes of clothing and so on.
Obviously weather plays a part but is there a general concensus on a 'minimum set of 600km items' ? (Especially on rides without specific sleeping facilities)
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Don't bother with blankets, bivvy bags etc.
Take a spare/dry base layer, gloves and possibly shorts if you are a chaffing sort of chap. I took a folding tyre for my 400 & 600's last year through darkest wales, but not on PBP. Same punture kit as a 200. Some emergency ibuprofen & pro plus. Small tin of vaseline! Emergency eats - I like Mulebars at the moment - just something to munch in the middle of the night when Coop won't be open in the next village...I have a txt file cribsheet somewhere at home.
To be honest, most of these are stuff I carry on a 200, the extras being night clothing. I can't remember the last time I thought of something I needed that I didn't have in my Carradice Barley.
Lay out what you want to take, then throw half of it out & pack the rest.
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It depends if I have a 'bag drop' or not and of course on the weather. I don't take a change of clothes but will leave one at a bag drop., perhaps a fresh vest or a long and short sleeved one. I don't think I have ever carried overshoes on a 600, maybe on the spectacularly wet Three Coasts last year. Not much more is needed for a 600 than 300. I do carry a space blanket but never needed it. Mu famous medicine chest of course and my 'get you through the night' pills. Spare socks if it is going to be wet perhaps. You will need to decide what you need though, everyone is different.
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I don't think I have ever carried overshoes on a 600, maybe on the spectacularly wet Three Coasts last year.
I rarely ride without taking overshoes, except in the depths of summer! Not for rain, but the slightest breeze & it's cold toe hell for me. Like you say, everyone's different.
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Loo paper
Immodium
MP3 player to help stay awake on night sections
Spare batteries for lights & MP3 player
Head torch for navigating/fettling
As others have said, warm clothing for night sections (needed even in the summer, believe me)
I always change my shorts, socks, gloves & shirt for day 2 so I carry those with me.
If there's an overnight stop/control I'll take a toothbrush & paste and possibly a small towel (for the BCM600 where you can shower)
Loads of money. I'm always amazed at how much can be spent at commercial controls/garages on a long ride.
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Loo paper
Immodium
MP3 player to help stay awake on night sections
Spare batteries for lights & MP3 player
Head torch for navigating/fettling
As others have said, warm clothing for night sections (needed even in the summer, believe me)
I always change my shorts, socks, gloves & shirt for day 2 so I carry those with me.
If there's an overnight stop/control I'll take a toothbrush & paste and possibly a small towel (for the BCM600 where you can shower)
Loads of money. I'm always amazed at how much can be spent at commercial controls/garages on a long ride.
I like the MP3 idea. I bought a tiny FM radio during my LEJoG and was amazed at how the miles passed quicker, even while listening to items about Bulgarian crop rotation on Radio 4.
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As others have said, warm clothing for night sections (needed even in the summer, believe me)
ISTR that the section from Menai to Dolgellau on the BCM last year was bloody freezing. I was wearing a SS top, arm warmers, a jacket and a woolly hat and I was still cold.
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Yes
I remember finishing the Brevet Cymru one year at about 1:30 am, and on the final run down from the Shirenewton crossroads to Chepstow I had all my warm clothes on and was still shivering so much that I could hardly steer
I guess it's not just the cold, it's that you're tired and hungry and generally at a low ebb in those wee small hours
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a complete change of clothes for wet / cold to dry / hot and a range of layers in between
a sleeping bag if I'm staying at l'Hotel Arrete Autobus
other than that nothing special; I've never even had a puncture on a 600.
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You will know what you need on a 600, if you do a 300, then 400 then 600. Learn from each ride, think about what worked, what didn't and how you might change things. With a careful and calculated build up a 600 will be no big deal.
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Tools: bike spanner, multitool, spare tube, preglued patches, tyre lever, pump
Medical: lipsalve, small amount of chamois cream, loo roll
Clothing: waterproof, spare shorts (I wear shorts, shirt, jersey, jacket, longs, gloves, and cap. Depending on weather, some of this will be in my saddlebag)
Other: batteries, mp3 player, lightweight lock, space blanket.
In my pockets: phone, cash, brevet card.
With that lot I'm warm enough over the summer at night, reasonably comfortable, and reasonably self-sufficient. If anything goes so badly wrong with me or the bike that I can't fix it with that lot, I wouldn't want to carry on anyway.
The lock is a comfort when you want to nip into shops or go to the loo. The space blanket makes sleeping in service stations and the like more comfortable. I'd like to be able to carry more clothing, but I have a carradice barley and that's its limit.
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What saddlebags do people use on 600s?
My Carradice Barley has worked fine on rides up to and including 300km but I'd struggle to get much more in it for a 600km ride.
Rack Pack (Carradice or the Agu Yamathingy)?
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What saddlebags do people use on 600s?
Carradice SQR as I don't routinely use a rack or indeed have eyelets for one). It does result in a more top heavy ride and probably pummels your 4rse more though; I've managed without even that on 2 (dry and sunny) 600s.
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Rackpack usually. That's normally enough. I did use a Carradice Camper monster saddlebag on LEL and on the BC600 perm.
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400km was my transition distance last year (my first SR) from Barley to SQR Tour. Basically, needing extra clothes for night makes the difference for me. Well, that and 3Kg of flapjack :thumbsup:.
The Three Coats Coasts was a handy figure 8 course, so I could pack for a 400 using the SQR Tour for the first day, and then swap bag to a Barley for the remaining 200 on Sunday.
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swap bag to a Barley for the remaining 200 on Sunday.
but where did you put the inflatable dinghy?
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Kit list like wot they said.
Used a Carradice Longflap camper (never used the longflap though!) last year. Trying out a Barley this year (on bagman support).
Going to carry a Goretex bivvibag this year (without sleeping bag) as it packs down small and is a little more attractive than wrapping up in a space blanket - condensation - ugh!
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swap bag to a Barley for the remaining 200 on Sunday.
but where did you put the inflatable dinghy?
Second day was hilly, and only rained during the morning so no need for a dinghy really; warm and sunny in the afternoon. Sheesh - that climb through Padiham in the afternoon sun on Sunday - I was All Done In by then...
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Only done one, took little more than I would for a 200.
I stuck on my Carradice Super C bag and put in an extra couple of tubes, and some food but I could have carried them in my jerseys. Spare shorts and socks as well, but they were wetter than the ones I was wearing as it was raining so much the wet seaped through.
Other than that it was so wet I wore everything else I was gonna be carrying in the bag. We stopped after about 350km and slept a few hours in a bunkhouse so no need for carrying sleeping gear (I did miss my slippers and teddy O:-) ;D).
So in summary: a bit more than I would on a 200, some extra clothes to cover weather changes. Oh, and more batteries for my lights.
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I use a rack pack too for 600s. Done 300s with a Super C saddle pack but it has less capacity.
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It's a good plan to use a design of bag that allows you to strap stuff on the outside, I think.
In general, stuff doubles in volume over the course of a 600, as it gets sweaty and mucky and you begin to lose the will to pack stuff neatly. You also need to factor in the large packet of biscuits you'll buy at one control, just in case, and carry round with you for the rest of the way, then throw out afterwards...
I usually use a rack pack (Arkel Tailrider). For a typical 600, inside: two spare tubes; headtorch; minitool; tyre patch; small toilet bag with toothbrush, toothpaste, Nurofen, and caffeine tablets (very rarely used); P20 sun stuff, if appropriate (ha!); iPod; phone; small cable lock; arm warmers; leg warmers; spare base layer; spare gloves; AA batteries for rear light; Buff; cotton cap; Montane windproof/showerproof top; Rainlegs (if the forecast is wet); a couple of energy bars; biro; zip ties; a couple of M5 bolts; my magic bungee. Strapped on outside: proper waterproof; overshoes, if I think I'll need them. In third bottle cage: old bottle containing tyre levers, repair kit, and another tube.
At any given time I may be wearing some or all of the garments mentioned above.
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It's a good plan to use a design of bag that allows you to strap stuff on the outside, I think.
I agree that is why I prefer a rack pack for a 600.
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In general, stuff doubles in volume over the course of a 600, as it gets sweaty and mucky and you begin to lose the will to pack stuff neatly. You also need to factor in the large packet of biscuits you'll buy at one control, just in case...
Ha HA ! Yes! That moment when, at 6:30am when you've been riding all night, and you buy a Jumbo Family Pack of Cheddars (because you just can't take any more sweetstuff) eat two for breakfast, open your completely-stuffed-and-bursting-at-the-seams saddle bag and think, "WTF do I do with these?".
Yes, it's true. I've bought a packet of Cheddars (for the receipt), eaten two, and chucked the rest in the bin.
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Same as for a 200, plus a toothbrush.
Which is (roughly): rainjacket, windproof, kneewarmers if it's warm enough for shorts during the day, usual tools and pump, loo paper, possibly a spare pair of socks.
I find that on a 6 am start it's generally cold enough that I'm wearing most of the clothing I'll need. I just have to make sure there's enough room to store it in the heat of the day.
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swap bag to a Barley for the remaining 200 on Sunday.
but where did you put the inflatable dinghy?
Second day was hilly, and only rained during the morning so no need for a dinghy really; warm and sunny in the afternoon. Sheesh - that climb through Padiham in the afternoon sun on Sunday - I was All Done In by then...
check :)
we got burnt up by a load of kids on BMX's on the way out of Padiham, and it was quite hard to actually stay with them; I had Ab Cohen for company for the rest of the ride; the man is an ox!
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i started to take a very lightweight crap bag that goes over both shoulders (i cannot possibly call it a rucksack) for when the control has buy one get one free on 1.5 litre bottles of water.
It fits very small into a rack pack or pocket and enables the portage of said water, or even a half eaten fish and chip supper, for a good couple of hours before it gets unbearable. Then the supper gets finished, or the water goes in the water bottles, and the bag can go back in the rack/pocket/barley. (a couple of toe clip straps will attach to the barley metal loops and hold a raincoat and said bag)
I'm getting a Camper Longflap this year as an experiment. I suspect it will be too large.
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I find a spare pair of shorts for a 600 to be a splendid thing - it's really cheering to be able to change. Spare shirt not so much, although if there's a drop bag on the BCM this year I'll put one in that.
I am trying really hard to take less stuff for the BCM this year - I have a tendency to overpack. Charlotte's offered to lend me a saddlebag so I can take the rack off (I normally use a pannier).
Less flapjack will prob be one thing - I invariably take more than I eat.
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I don't think anybody's mentionned chain oil yet. I tend to take a small pot on 600+ rides. I find a wet 600 is about 200km too long to get away without a top-up of chain lube...
Mind you, I'm not exactly known for travelling light on longer rides. BCM I did with a 20ltr pannier. PBP I took two 20ltr panniers...
Most over rides I use a carradice super C. The exception being the tandem, where we carry a full pannier, mainly consisting of tools/tubes/spares parts...
AC
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Never carried chain oil on an audax, can usually blag some if needed. Tuggo did the honours on the 2007 BCM, bike shop in Lincoln on 2005 LEL, bike hire place in a castle in 2007 Ower The Edge. Mechanic at Loudeac on 2007 PBP.
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Spare brake blocks for a hilly, wet ride. I trashed a whole set in 100k on one ride last year - though that's very unusual
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Spare brake blocks for a hilly, wet ride. I trashed a whole set in 100k on one ride last year - though that's very unusual
I fitted new blocks around Feb 2007. They looking a little worn now.
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Oh indeed
I changed the ones I put on the MC when it was new (late 2005) just before PBP mainly because I thought I ought :)
But I didn't do many wet/orrid rides on that. The On-One, used early season, chews 'em up.
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The Dean chewed through half a pair of blocks on the front thanks to the evil crosswinds on most of the open descents. My legs weren't in a spinny mood on some of the other descents either.
I carried a spare set of Campag brake pads around for ages until it dawned on my that both the Condor and the Aravis have Shimano/Tektro deep-drop brakes.
Will look at the SQR Tour although I think I prefer the rackpack idea.
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I've also found the Barley a bit small for a 600km. I tried an SQR tour, but I found that its length meant that it "wagged the dog" a bit too much for my liking when climbing.
I think I might get a Pendle, which has 3 litres more cpacity than the Barley http://www.carradice.co.uk/saddlebags/pendle-saddlebag.shtml, for the longer rides.
I'm also trying to work out a useable home-made handlebar bag based on a 2 compartment design. One a sort of grab bag for snacks on the go and the 2nd part, a closed compartment for things I might want to keep separate for clothes. The whole thing would have a flat top to take a map/routesheet.
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The Barley was fine again on the 300 this weekend but it was nearly full. If I'd have needed to take anything off I would have struggled to fit it in anywhere.
Going to pack the contents of the Barley into my Creek2Peak rack bag and see how much space is left over (should be quite a bit). I've also got to cut down the amount of stuff I drag round with me so I've got to get used to leaving the rack bag half-empty (or half-full depending on your POV).
The Pendle (and the Nelson) both look good. I'll see if my local Carradice supplier (in Merton) has them next time I'm down that way.
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I'm terrible because, although I have a Barley, I use my Nelson longflap and overpack! I do tend to take far too much stuff - on my last 200 I had 2 jackets and a gilet with me ;D
I envisage myself being stuck somewhere in need of a 8mm allen key for a square taper bottom bracket and a set of pliers. However, I think that the Nelson would be great for a 600 (or maybe I'd need a Camper longflap). I'd have spare clothes, a blow up bed, a wheel truning stand, dishing tool, headset press tool - you know the basic tool kit.
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You may laugh about carrying all that crap. I was out with Simon Jones on a night ride through London with Charlotte and he fixed her loose headset with a 2 inch adjustable spanner he happened to be carrying.
Try picking up Steve Airey's bike! Peliroja and I ran into him on a 300k last year and we reckon if weighed more than she did.
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i found a kit list in my box of audax paper work
I'm not sure what ride I did it for, a 400 or 600 I think
Headtorch
main light
2x spare main light batteries
14x packs of frog powder
L/S base layer
water proof socks
wintex longs
head band
maps
spare route sheet
change of shorts
change of top
gortex coat
spare contact lenses
pack of tissues
banana
flapjack
mobile phone
sunglasses
Note the list doesn't include any tools or a pump
I normally carry
multitool
duct tape
several cable ties
small screwdriver
pliers with side cutter
puncture repair kit
spare powerlink/bits of chain
spare misc. nuts and bolts
tyre boot
insulating tape
I have done one 600 ( a wet Bryan Chapman ) with just a Barley saddlebag but it was a bit tight. It's more comfortable with a Super C 20 litre thing
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I think I may bungee some spare clothes on my rack in a waterproof bag and use my Barley. At some point I may need to consider just taking 1 Ortleib pannier instead of saddlebag+rack option.
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Incidentally, in the run up to PBP I reduced the size of a lot of my regular gear.
Smaller headtorches can save you a fair bit of space.
Do you really need spare batteries? Put fresh ones in before the ride and you shouldn't need them. A good headtorch can save you carrying both a spare light and spare batteries for it.
I did the maths on powdered drinks as well. Its cheaper to buy tablets (unless you buy kilos and kilos of powdered Maxim or whatever). They take up less space and are less fiddly to dispense into the bottle. However, most garages and newsagents dispense some sort of sports drink. Less crap to carry and you have to buy something at controls!
For PBP I took a spoon, after having to eat yogurt with a tyre lever on one ride!
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I found that my Barley was adequate for the BCM last year. I did leave behind some stuff that I was planning to take, namely spare socks, shorts and shirt. If it rains, this stuff would be really handy. Otherwise, I can wear the same pair of shorts for a week and not be bothered (others might be by the smell ;)).
Smaller headtorches can save you a fair bit of space.
Do you really need spare batteries?
This stuff saves a very small amount of space. 3 AAA batteries take up next to no room compared to a jacket or a pair of shorts. My advice is that you take enough clothes to survive down to about -10 and wear most of them all the way round, hence saving space in your bag.
I take about the same amount of kit on a 200 as on a 600. Some people take very little stuff, I almost got crucified on ACF for suggesting that a Barley is a good idea for audax.
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My advice is that you take enough clothes to survive down to about -10 and wear most of them all the way round, hence saving space in your bag.
I'm with you on that. The only changes in clothing I made on Saturday were changing from mitts+cotton gloves to waterproof gloves at sunset and putting on a thinsulate skull cap. Temperature went from freezing to mild (10oC?) and back to freezing and I didn't even take my jacket off at any of the controls. But I'm lucky in that I don't feel any negative effects from over-heating.
I take about the same amount of kit on a 200 as on a 600. Some people take very little stuff, I almost got crucified on ACF for suggesting that a Barley is a good idea for audax.
Again, I can't see myself taking any more on a 600 that I have done on a 300, but that's probably because I take enough for a 600 on a 300. I might just like a bigger bag for the same amount which stops me having to faff so much when I need something. The re-packing Barley->RackPack will be done later this evening.
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Again, I can't see myself taking any more on a 600 that I have done on a 300, but that's probably because I take enough for a 600 on a 300. I might just like a bigger bag for the same amount which stops me having to faff so much when I need something. The re-packing Barley->RackPack will be done later this evening.
And stunningly exciting the re-packing was too. Plenty of space left over so that's a couple of extra tubes, spare shorts/socks/jersey (maybe) and stash space for items as it gets warmer during the day.
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I'm getting addicted to having a small pannier as well as a rackpack... overshoes and rainlegs and so on go easily in there. Reduces the intellectual demands of understanding the packing process, which can overwhelm me after more than a few hours.
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...the intellectual demands of understanding the packing process...
The late, fearsome Jean Luxton watched me removing outer garments at a control and depositing them in the saddlebag.
"Men don't pack," said she, "They stuff."