adding infos to a .gpx

[citoyen]

To my mind, there comes a point where you just have to stop worrying about the many different needs of riders and let them do the worrying about what file format will work on their particular device. Otherwise you end up with numerous different versions of your file that you have to maintain, with all the risks that entails.

[Pingu]

Yes. The riders need to take some responsibility and learn how their devices work.

[willpom gwraudax]

Simple answer is to provide a zip file containing the full route and individual splits between all the controls; or just split to infos if the controls are obvious. And explain what is needed for validation before and at the start.

You should easily be able to split a route in RWGPS with a free account. View the route (not edit), highlight the section on the elevation profile, save as new route. It is easier to edit the new route sections to trim than try and do by highlighting on the original.

[zacklaws]

I have done this for a long time with no issues, but this year I have been having issues with info's and controls showing up on a GPX track, they just disappear after loading the GPX track onto the Garmin Edge. The only program I ever use is Garmin mapsource as it is far simpler and easier to use than Basecamp which is a load of junk.

Sometimes when I start my GPX track, they would not be on the track or they would all flash up one after another at the bottom of the screen telling me I was there, and this is before the wheels had started turning.

I tried other programs with the same result. The only way that I could do it successfully was to use Garmin Connect which is a awful program to use. I don't know why, I got the impression that Garmin did something with its programming somewhere with an update, they are renowned for introducing updates which are supposed to fix something but also break other things. Also I was not the only one who had this issue I found out. Some RWGPS also had the problem, myself included when I tried it.

Also elevation data in a GPX track would be removed for some reason when using mapsource even though it was there and could see the profile, but absent on the ,,"Edge".

But the best failproof method I use is just break a GPX track up into segments from control to control or info, that way you never miss them as the track finishes at the control or info plus you still get the distance and time to go into.

[GdS]

I used Mapsource until my PC blew up and couldn't load anything other than a basemap onto it so useless for plotting routes.

Basecamp is OK but overengineered for cycling. But it seems to be the best thing for an etrex even though it refuses to load the map from my PC I have to use the one in the device. Clubmates can't believe I can get it to work the same way as an Edge for navigation (on road) and say I should bin it!

[GdS]

Yes. The riders  need to take some responsibility and learn howtheir devices work.

riders also need to take some responsibility and learn how AUK rides work, just following the track and turning up at the finish * with a blank brevet is becoming quite common on my events not sure about anyone else?

* or even not even turning up at the finish and going home 

[grimpeur du sudocrem]

I've done it before by editing the GPX file in a text editor and adding the tags before the main trkseg bit...


<wpt lat="51.310187" lon="0.189898">
    <ele>0</ele>
    <name>Otford</name>
    <sym>Waypoint</sym>
    <type>Generic</type>
  </wpt>

Any other tags needed for Wahoo alerts? Been trying to get a workable method for this for ages with mixed success. It would be very nice if Wahoo would develop a tool, but no joy yet.

With the caveat that I know nothing about the special requirements of Wahoo devices, this is the form the waypoints took in the GPX files for my last event:

  <wpt lat="51.31492" lon="0.98421">
    <name>01 INFO Dargate</name>
  </wpt>

(ie you don't even need the <ele>, <sym> or <type> tags, but I note Phil's point about needing to include the proximity alert for Etrex devices. I've always managed without proximity alerts on my Edge.)

IIRC, I created the waypoints in GPX Editor (have also used Basecamp) and exported them as a separate file to the track. You can then copy and paste the waypoints into the main track in a text editor.

3. I run it through my simple-gpx utility which adds the additional information for both proximity alarms and Wahoo cue points.
...
Note it is important that the latitude and longitude of the waypoints exactly match that of a point on the track in the GPX.  My simple-gpx (on PC) finds the nearest track point for each waypoint and makes the coordinates exactly the same.  If they are not the same they won’t be recognised as custom cues when imported to RWGPS and won’t alert on Wahoo units. 

Useful to know, thanks!

OK, after some experimentation it does seem that the crucial point for Wahoo to recognise the waypoint is that the waypoint lat and long match that of one of the trackpoints in the file.

Also, the description that appears in the Route Info comes from the <desc> tag not the <name> tag, so include <desc>01 INFO Dargate</desc> if you want relevant text (it will still appear without <desc>, but with a description of 0).

Thanks all! Will be a big help to me to get alerts for those pesky infos. Now I just need to actually do some audaxes, only 1 so far this year thanks to Covid and other crap...

[willpom gwraudax]

That is interesting. I've only ever put all details in the <name> (RWGPS) and not bothered with <desc> (which is also duplicated as <cmt> in RWGPS). No Wahoo users have ever commented but then I think they sync the route with the cues as all the route points; the waypoints just duplicate the route point controls and any cautions points.

I'd be interested in any riders who've done my routes using a Wahoo who are reading this if they could comment if waypoints show.

Also, the description that appears in the Route Info comes from the <desc> tag not the <name> tag, so include <desc>01 INFO Dargate</desc> if you want relevant text (it will still appear without <desc>, but with a description of 0.

From your observations I'd be tempted to include the route info in <name>, <desc> & <cmt> to make sure all devices are covered.

[citoyen]

Yes, very useful to know, thanks.

If it's possible to create a single file that works for everyone through the simple addition of the right tags, and without the toing and froing of uploading/downloading files between various apps, that could prevent a lot of potential headaches.

Manually adding <desc> tags to waypoints in the GPX file is easy enough to do - but of course, if Phil were minded to include this as an automated function in his app... 

[grimpeur du sudocrem]

I would caveat that this was just from my experimentation so may not be gospel - what would be really helpful would be technical documentation from Wahoo et al explaining how it works - we can dream...

[Ian H]

...

But the best failproof method I use is just break a GPX track up into segments from control to control or info, that way you never miss them as the track finishes at the control or info plus you still get the distance and time to go into.

I did that for my events until one rider managed to combine all the tracks, sailed past a control, and blamed me in emphatic terms for missing it.

[willpom gwraudax]

I have in the past suggested to RWGPS they include a checkbox on the cue to duplicate as a poi so it is exactly matched. No movement there though.

I was looking at GPX schema the other day because of this and I did find one page that said you could add <name> etc to <trkpt> to produce a hybrid track/route. In affect a GPX version of tcx/fit, but that gets complicated and not sure which devices would actually read it.

[willpom gwraudax]

...

But the best failproof method I use is just break a GPX track up into segments from control to control or info, that way you never miss them as the track finishes at the control or info plus you still get the distance and time to go into.

I did that for my events until one rider managed to combine all the tracks, sailed past a control, and blamed me in emphatic terms for missing it.

It doesn't matter how much information you give people there is always one, but most likely more nowadays...

[grams]

Separate segments may be flattened by some software/workflows/devices. You can’t make assumptions about how they’ll be seen by the user.

(Though it’s the rider’s responsibility to keep track of where the controls are!)

[frankly frankie]

IME splitting a track into segments rarely has any visible effect on a device or in software - it is still treated as a single track, just with possible breaks or discontinuities (but these do not constitute a hard break point or 'go to' point).  So for example:

Code: [Select]

<trk>
   <name>Track 1</name>
  <trkseg>
   <trkpt lat="53.39451" lon="-2.06353">
   </trkpt>
  ... etc more trackpoints
  </trkseg>

  <trkseg>
   <trkpt lat="53.39473" lon="-2.06473">
   </trkpt>
  ... etc more trackpoints
  </trkseg>
</trk>doesn't IMHO achieve anything useful.  Segments simply indicate breaks in a ridden Tracklog - eg a tunnel or thick tree cover.

However you can have multiple Tracks in a single GPX - that's part of the standard - and these would each have an end point.
So rewriting the above as:

Code: [Select]

<trk>
   <name>Track 1</name>
  <trkseg>
   <trkpt lat="53.39451" lon="-2.06353">
   </trkpt>
  ... etc more trackpoints
  </trkseg>
</trk>
<trk>
   <name>Track 2</name>
  <trkseg>
   <trkpt lat="53.39473" lon="-2.06473">
   </trkpt>
  ... etc more trackpoints
  </trkseg>
</trk>- in other words, splitting a single Track into two or more Tracks - would have the desired effect.
One compatibility problem with this is that early Edge models (eg, 800) did not play well with multi-track GPX files - importing only the first Track found and rejecting the rest.  I think this bug was soon fixed in later Edge models (my Explore 2 is fine with it).