Bikepacking Bags - what's your favourite/hated and why?

[bhoot]

For many years I have used a toe strap to apply one brake when the bike is on a train (wheels on floor, so many commuter/short distance trains). It gives a massive reassurance that you can go and sit down knowing it won't be careering all over the place. The tandem neatly avoids this by having a "parking brake" is a third brake controlled by a bar end gear shifter.

[Lightning Phil]

I sometimes take a hooked bungy cord with me to keep the bike in place on trains

[perpetual dan]

If by Rixen and Kaul bracket you mean the bar-bag bracket, as used by almost every conventional bar bag nowadays, then I agree. It's an abomination, placing the weight way too far off the front, with adverse effects on both handling and bounceability.
…

Yes, that’s the one. A flat plate held onto the bag by four rivets. The handlebar fitting involves screws into plastic.
I do tend to use my bar bag as my “keep it with me” bag, if I’m wandering off to look at things or go into shops, sit on trains etc.

[rabbit]

I've just got a Tailfin to try it out. Normally I don't like roll tops as I think they are a pain to access and not necessary, but I thought I'd try it as lots of people rave about them. Not used it yet.

Hey Frank - just wondered if you have gotten round to trying the Tailfin yet? I am swaying rapidly toward their set up - I particularly like the idea of the carbon rack with the option to add panniers as and when I need them. The entire packing set up with rack, tail pack, panniers and frame etc is eyewatering, but it seems like such a smart set up. It will be really interesting to hear your opinion on them and whether they are worth the vast quantities of money.

[morbihan]

I recently got back from a bike packing event in the Netherlands and there were a plethora of set ups. Tailfin featured very heavily indeed. Aside from the seat packs, lots of tailfin frame bags too.
The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed. To be fair that could have been more about his bike geo.
Personally Im not a fan of under seat roll bags (windsock type affairs) and favour a Carradice type seat bag on a frame.
I use this one.
https://builtbyswift.com/shop/zeitgeist-pack/

Ive had some revelate frame bags for quite a few years that have had a hard life and they are still in great shape. Overbuilt zips etc. They are really well constructed. it's a shame they are only black or battleship grey.

I have a sunlite trunk bag that I like to use a lot too. It's got fold away side pockets and a bungee to stash stuff on the top. It's easily taken on and off pannier frame with velcro. It's not very water resistant.
I have an arkel trunk bag too thats  similar very neat but find its too small for most of my trips.

I use front panniers over rear generally as the bike feels really stable that way.

By far my favourite bag right now is a Gramm diamond bag. It needs a front rack though. It's a really neat bit of kit, very compact but big enough to stash a fair bit of stuff. There is even a rear portal for wires to stash electrical gear. I actually switched out our big Rando bags that were pretty cumbersome for these bags as they are so good.
Gramm made me some custom bags for my gravel bike too which are fabulous.
image of the bags here.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CqGMOmTOynL/?img_index=1

If you are touring heavy,  and have the toe clearance, the old ortlieb roll top panniers are great.
We used to and like the ortlieb bar bags as well with the click fix attachment (a bit fiddly) but TBH with the Gramm diamond bags I can't see ever fitting them again. The later versions with magnets for closing the lid are pretty cool.

[alfapete]

I like the ones going secondhand on ebay - don't do enough touring to make it worth spending a lot of money. Picked up some very cheap Carradice front panniers there which will be tested next month.

[Frank9755]

I've just got a Tailfin to try it out. Normally I don't like roll tops as I think they are a pain to access and not necessary, but I thought I'd try it as lots of people rave about them. Not used it yet.

Hey Frank - just wondered if you have gotten round to trying the Tailfin yet? I am swaying rapidly toward their set up - I particularly like the idea of the carbon rack with the option to add panniers as and when I need them. The entire packing set up with rack, tail pack, panniers and frame etc is eyewatering, but it seems like such a smart set up. It will be really interesting to hear your opinion on them and whether they are worth the vast quantities of money.

No, not yet - sorry!  I had to cancel my planned trip a couple of weeks ago so will take me a bit longer to give them a proper try out.

If you search there is a good thread on here where lots of people who have used them give their opinions.  Tl;dr is
- lots of people who know what they are talking about like them a lot. 
- But some have reservations, mainly around the accessibility of roll-top luggage and surprisingly poor light fitting options. 
- However I don't think I have seen anyone say they are not in principle a good way to carry luggage, or that they are not good aerodynamically. 

[Frank9755]

The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed.

Interesting.  My planned trip was going to include Ventoux so I would have been able to give an opinion on that, if I'd gone!

[Andrew Br]

If you search there is a good thread on here where lots of people who have used them give their opinions.  Tl;dr is
- lots of people who know what they are talking about like them a lot. 
- But some have reservations, mainly around the accessibility of roll-top luggage and surprisingly poor light fitting options. 
- However I don't think I have seen anyone say they are not in principle a good way to carry luggage, or that they are not good aerodynamically.

I like to think I know what I'm talking about 
I do have issues with the accessibility of the rack-pack when I'm using it for day rides. Undo 3 straps and then roll the top back ? No, it's rubbish. Tailfin dismissed my objections/suggestions.
As for the light attachments........... Tailffin staff do their own thing, a complete admission (IMO) that their light fitting options are crap.

The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed.

My bike felt unstable on the ride last weekend. I put it down to the bike being rather "tail heavy" with most of the weight on the rack.
I hope to correct that before my tour in July.

[TPMB12]

Late to this thread but I like these uk producers. I have things from both of them.  All uk made.

https://www.bike-bag.co.uk/index.html

https://www.camelchopsgear.co.uk/

The first one I got a full frame bag made,  completely custom based on my cardboard template created based on their instructions. Very well made and high capacity since I've got a big bike.

Also look at Aiguille Alpine. A rucksack maker in Staveley, Cumbria I've got a custom design rucksack from.  They also make bike bags.  Very well made in Staveley.  The guy who owns it kind of mentored the owner of atom rucksacks.

[Frank9755]

The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed.

I was thinking about this when I was out today.  I don't see how something at the back of the bike could have a really bad effect on handling.  I would expect it to, if anything, act like a disc wheel, and make the bike more stable in a crosswind.

It is possible that additional 'stability' might not be helpful on a twisting descent by making the steering slower, but I don't think it would amount to much.  I'll have a better-informed view when I finally get it set up, though!

[quixoticgeek]

I have two lights mounted to my tailfin, plus brackets for two more fitted, but not populated. Not an issue for me with how to attach lights.

Also not noticed any issues with balance. I find it a lot more balanced than a typical bike packing saddle bag as it doesn't move.

I've done a few thousand km with a tailfin aeropack. I still really like it. I still highly recommend it.

J

[Cudzoziemiec]

Weight at the back can definitely have a bad effect on handling, particularly if it's not forward of the rear wheel axle. I've experienced this myself, but that was on a short-chainstayed bike with fairly flexy frame (1980s hi-ten) onto which I had bodged a rack with overloaded panniers and no front load. I think it would have to be a significantly humongous saddlepack to achieve the same effect.

[Lightning Phil]

The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed.

I was thinking about this when I was out today.  I don't see how something at the back of the bike could have a really bad effect on handling.  I would expect it to, if anything, act like a disc wheel, and make the bike more stable in a crosswind.

It is possible that additional 'stability' might not be helpful on a twisting descent by making the steering slower, but I don't think it would amount to much.  I'll have a better-informed view when I finally get it set up, though!

Get someone heavy on the back of a tandem and you’ll soon find the tail wagging the dog effect of their weight.  If you have a super light bike where a filled tail fin matches or exceeds the bike weight I can imagine there might be some tail wagging. You’d get the pendulum effect with associated harmonics when out the saddle. If you are well built or load up your bike fairly heavily front to back, you’d likely not notice.

[morbihan]

Ref the rear weighted stability and the tail fin, I hasten to add that it was only one rider who mentioned it to me. I dont remember the exact set up except it was a pretty aerodynamic looking, maybe a really twitchy race bike and it could also be someone who generally doesn't ride with bags aboard.
The only analogy I have personally is if I stuff my Carradice bags that are on an under seat frame attached to the saddle full of chickens etc on a fam shop ride. (not live ones!!!) The bike gets pretty fish taily at the back. It's a lot of heavy weight up high and no weight down low or forward.
Ive had a similar experience when really loading up large rear panniers.
At the end of the spectrum, on RatN I had front panniers and not too much weight at the back. The bike felt rock solid down hill approaching 60kph. Riding those front panniers into the Dutch head wind on the other hand wasn't my favourite experience.
I think the general rule of thumb is heavy stuff down low and ideally inside the triangle.

Just seen your comment come in Phil, thats pretty much how I see it too though no experience of a tandem.

[Andrew Br]

My instability issue was only noticeable on fast corners. It felt like the "rear steer" that I've experienced in cars where the suspension bushes are worn.
I ride a carbon GT Grade where the seat stays are very thin and connect to the top rather than the seat tube. I suspect this was part of the problem.
I didn't notice the effect when I was touring on the bike with a very similar set up last year. The only difference is that the (small) frame and the larger handlebar bag had more of the heavy items in them.
That's what I'll try to replicate for this year's tours.

[chrisbainbridge]

I love my tailfin although I agree about the straps.
The lighting bar is not brilliant.
Raceware make a couple of adapters. The price is clearly set not to upset anyone who can afford a tailfin.

[rabbit]

Thanks All,

Really appreciate the feedback re: Tailfin. I am not too worried about the fishtail effect, I'm not a maniac descending on the roads anyway, and off road I doubt I'll be going quick enough to get too much negative impact from it. Most of the time I suspect it will be set up with some Tailfin panniers anyway as a full touring set up.

I just have to convince myself that I can afford/justify the layout as it is a scary scary amount of cash.

[ravenbait]

I've just got a Tailfin to try it out. Normally I don't like roll tops as I think they are a pain to access and not necessary, but I thought I'd try it as lots of people rave about them. Not used it yet.

Hey Frank - just wondered if you have gotten round to trying the Tailfin yet? I am swaying rapidly toward their set up - I particularly like the idea of the carbon rack with the option to add panniers as and when I need them. The entire packing set up with rack, tail pack, panniers and frame etc is eyewatering, but it seems like such a smart set up. It will be really interesting to hear your opinion on them and whether they are worth the vast quantities of money.

This is what I have. Carbon Tailfin, AP20, recently added panniers, and now I have a top tube bag (flip) too (marginally prefer the Restrap one which is a taller, teardrop shaped thing, because it's narrower). I love my tailfin stuff. I am A Huge Fan. Agreed the dangly straps can be an issue if you need to access the bag frequently, but I don't tend to put the stuff I need frequently in the AP20. That's what stem bags (Restrap) and the top tube bag are for. I didn't buy it all at once - that would have caused my bank manager to have a heart attack -- but I got the rack and AP20 a couple of years ago, then gradually added other bits.

Haven't had to use the panniers in anger yet, but I'm impressed with what I got.

I met a guy on the train a few weeks ago who was off to cycle from Amsterdam to Portugal somewhere, and he had the full Tailfin kit with the rack, panniers, AP20. He was smitten with it. We were both somewhat delayed as we stood on Platform 18 in Waverley raving about Tailfin.

Sam

[Frank9755]

The only negative I heard about the tailfin seat pack was chatting to one rider who said his bike felt unstable descending at speed.

I was thinking about this when I was out today.  I don't see how something at the back of the bike could have a really bad effect on handling.  I would expect it to, if anything, act like a disc wheel, and make the bike more stable in a crosswind.

It is possible that additional 'stability' might not be helpful on a twisting descent by making the steering slower, but I don't think it would amount to much.  I'll have a better-informed view when I finally get it set up, though!

Get someone heavy on the back of a tandem and you’ll soon find the tail wagging the dog effect of their weight.  If you have a super light bike where a filled tail fin matches or exceeds the bike weight I can imagine there might be some tail wagging. You’d get the pendulum effect with associated harmonics when out the saddle. If you are well built or load up your bike fairly heavily front to back, you’d likely not notice.

Yes, but aren't these two different points? Morbihan's correspondent was talking about descending at speed, so an aerodynamics thing as he most likely wouldn't be pedalling and certainly not standing up.  What happens when you are pedalling hard, especially standing up, is where, as you say, frame stiffness and weight distribution are important! 

[Goldcrank]

Has anyone used ne of these?

Specialized Fjällräven Seatbag Harness ( https://www.fjallraven.com/uk/en-gb/bags-gear/fjallraven-specialized/sf-seatbag-harness/ )

It looks similar to that Arkel, but not as high up.

[Frank9755]

It is a similar idea to Arkel as it hangs from the saddle rails with the seat post fixing as a secondary point for stability.  And it puts the bag in pretty much the same place / height as the Arkel one.

But it has a lot more metal (and other material) than the Arkel one and has more straps.  The Arkel one is just one strap so really quick to take on and off. 

This one allows you to use any dry bag, but the Arkel drybag is pretty much ideal for the job - a good size and shape and fully waterproof.  I don't have a better one in my collection for this purpose.

The one advantage I can see is that the lower section of the frame - which Arkel doesn't have - can potentially allow you to keep the bag higher above your wheel.  Wheel clearance is a limitation of the Arkel one for shorter riders.  I'm 1'70 and I don't think Arkel would work for people with legs more than a couple of cm shorter than mine - but this looks like it might.

EDIT - As well as saddle height, the reason I have only moderate rear wheel clearance with the Arkel bag is because I have a lot of saddle setback which means the bag is quite flat.  Someone shorter but with less setback may well have greater clearance as they will be able to angle the bag upwards, away from the wheel.

[Goldcrank]

I have almost the opposite issue.  There’s 50cm of space between my rear tyre and my seat. 

[vorsprung]

I looked at Tailfin racks but then got a Tortec ultralight instead,  Yes, the bike I was putting on on had rack eyes
I looked at their bags and decided it wasn't quite what i wanted

At the opposite end of the price scale...slightly heavier but good kit is Lomo https://www.lomo.co.uk/product-category/cycle/cycling-dry-bags-luggage/

One thing I think is worth mentioning.   Vacuum bags for clothes.  They are thick plastic bags with a double ziplock seal.  You push out the air from the clothes by rolling the bag and then "zip up".  The result is a wooden-like compressed lump of clothes that will use the minimal amount of space

[Horizon]

It's a shame that Tortec cripple that rack, and some others, by not having any option to clip a bungee or strap to the bottom of it. I can't understand how something so fundamental to racks can be omitted.