10 speed shimano chain breakage

[sletti]

Greetings one and all.

First time poster, but long time bike nut. So I'll wade in with a vexing problem, that may have brough my life to an all too sudden end on my ride in to work this morning.

The drivetrain consists of Dura Ace 7800 levers pulling a Dura-Ace 7900 mech moving an Ultegra chain between an FSA chainset and 105 10 speed cassette. I put it together last night having bought the bits (attached to a Focus frame) from a mate. I have been removing and replacing chains on all manner of bikes for thirty years; 5, 6, 7, 8 and 9 speed (mostly shimano drivetrains) and this is the first time I have removed and replaced a chain on a 10 speed cassette.

The drivetrain survived a couple of long uphill slogs this morning with no issues, but while trundling along on a quite flat bit, the chain snapped. The pin had been pulled clean out of the outer plate. Thankfully I bimpled to a stop but if it had happened five minutes earlier I would probably have ended up under the wheels or an artic. Presumably the inital strain on the chain had been done during the climbs and it is merely coincidental that it came off at that juncture. (and for the record, I am about as far away from the mechanical output of Cavendish as it is possible to be).

Any thoughts?

Is the pushing of chain rivets on a 10 speed to be avoided (the Ultegra chain looks like the pin ends may well be mildly peened) and is a powerlink a better solution. I'm gonna put on an SRAM chain as I have found them to be generally better than Shimano's offerings (probably bollocks but it works for me))

I'd relish any suggestions before I relabel my new steed as "potential murderer"

Many thanks

Stig

[tiermat]

I had so many problems with Ultegra chains that I now either join them with SRAM powerlinks, or use SRAM chains (which come with the powerlinks anyway).

After about the second or third one I spoke to my LBS about it and they told me that as a matter of course they bin the joining pin and just use a powerlink.  If it is good enough for them, then it works for me

[Little Jim]

The Shimano chains need a special joining pin as the pins are peened as you say, and putting the existing pin back in means that the end is no longer peened and so prone to coming out.   But as Tiermat says, just use the SRAM joining links instead.

[sletti]

How does one identify the special joining pin. If it is not apparent then presumably I have pushed the wrong pin and unless that is the one that has failed, I may have to use 2 powerlinks to make the damn thing useable!

Oh sod it; I'll wait for my SRAM chain to arrive! Anyone want a broken Utlegra chain?

[mrcharly-YHT]

I think that you can remove any link with a chainbreaker, but you need to replace the link with a powerlink.

[Chris N]

You need a special pin to join a Shimano chain.  See here: http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/techdocs/content/cycle/SI/Chain/SI_08V0C/SI-08V0C-001-ENG_v1_m56577569830682230.pdf

SRAM 10 speed chains need a specific (and not reusable) PowerLock to join.

Wipperman chains need neither - they come with a reusable link.

[Little Jim]

You have to buy the special joining pin - it looks like a double length pin, but half of it is slightly tappered to make installation easier I suppose, and it also has a "neck" in it at the half way point so that it then snaps off in the correct place - presumeably snapping it off slightly mushrooms that end over at the same time to have the same effect as peening it, although Biggsy will be along in a bit to tell you where I am wrong!  It is a lot easier just to buy a Powerlink.

[Biggsy]

I'm not going to argue with anything here yet.

Any Powerlink-style resuable link can be used on any make and model of chain, as long as the width is suitable.

I think Shimano 10-speed chain is 5.9mm (or very nearly), like Campag's current 10-speed, but check this.

I use Wipperman Connex links successfully with my Campag 10-speed chains.  KMC's are cheaper; but check the width of KMC chain.

[sletti]

Now that I did not know. Life is just one long education, and have barely left the starting blocks.

Clever solution though. Is this a feature of 10 speed chains? I have had many different 8 speed setups with no probs, and my mountainbike has a 9 speed chain that was installed in the time honoured tradition.

Thanks for the info, chaps. Very enlightening.

[sletti]

I'm not going to argue with anything here yet.

Any Powerlink-style resuable link can be used on any make and model of chain, as long as the width is suitable.

I think Shimano 10-speed chain is 5.9mm (or very nearly), like Campag's current 10-speed, but check this.

I use Wipperman Connex links successfully with my Campag 10-speed chains.  KMC's are cheaper; just check the width of KMC chain.

So unlike the Powerlink, the Connex is reusable on a 10 speed?

[Biggsy]

Peening makes the chain laterally stronger and more reliable.  This is done with plenty of 8 and 9-speed chains as well as 10-speeds.  I personally first noticed it on the SRAM PC58, if I remember rightly.  So they've been around for ten years at least.

You can still join them in the conventional way, but a sliver of metal is removed from the plate, around the hole, when you press a pin out, and it might even crack later.  So it's not ideal.

Your breakage could have been related to this, or just bad luck.

Campag 10-speed chain is superb, and should also work fine with $himaNO.     These too are not supposed to be joined without a special pin (supplied), but do in fact work fine with a third-pary connecting link.

[Biggsy]

So unlike the Powerlink, the Connex is reusable on a 10 speed?

Yes.  The KMC one too.

[sletti]

Campag 10-speed chain is superb, and should also work fine with $himaNO.     These too are not supposed to be joined without a special pin (supplied), but do in fact work fine with a third-pary connecting link.

Do I detect some Campag/Shimano rivalry there?

[Biggsy]

Oh yes. 

I'm not very serious about it myself, though, as I pedal my Campag-equiped bikes with Shimano shoes.  I even have Shimano pedals on one set of Campag cranks.

[sletti]

Oh yes. 

I'm not very serious about it myself, though, as I pedal my Campag-equiped bikes with Shimano shoes.  I even have Shimano pedals on a set of Campag cranks.

I got into racing in the mid 80's when Campag was rubbish compared to the offerings from the Land of the Rising Sun. Still hold onto that prejudice even now that it is every bit as good, so until Suntour rise like a phoenix from the ashes( ), I'll be a Shimanophile. 

Perhaps I could convince someone to start making my dream invention; a chain consisting of 57 inner plates and 57 powerlinks...

[Efrogwr]

Perhaps I could convince someone to start making my dream invention; a chain consisting of 57 inner plates and 57 powerlinks...

You could do it yourself

As the others said, you cannot re-rivet a ten speed chain. I wouldn't do it to a nine speed either. Although it's OK with eight speeds or fewer, the quick connectors are so quick and convenient (and adequately strong) that I use them exclusively when replacing chains. KMC and Taya work well. Wipperman chains have a good reputation. All the quick links are re-useable.

[Biggsy]

Perhaps I could convince someone to start making my dream invention; a chain consisting of 57 inner plates and 57 powerlinks...

You could do it yourself

Like most good or mad ideas to do with bikes, someone has already done it.  I can't find it on Google Images now though.

[Adam]

I'm going to be the awkward one, and say I've been using 10 speed chains for over 3 years on both my road bikes, and when they first go on, I use the special pin, but when I've had to split them, I always join them using the normal rivet I took out.  If you carefully line things up, you don't end up with a sliver of metal breaking off.

Not had any problems.

On my 7 speed commuter bike I do the same, apart from the one time I used a KMC link which then broke after a few hundred miles.

[Biggsy]

If you carefully line things up, you don't end up with a sliver of metal breaking off.

Are you sure, because how does a pin - that has had its end made larger than the hole - fit through the hole without removing material from the plate?  I don't reckon the steel plate is elastic enough to stretch.  The sliver is small and easy to not notice if it falls on the floor.

I know it can work though (even though a silver comes off) - I've done it myself with peened 8 and 9-speed chains - but I wouldn't recommend it.  Connecting links are nicer to use anyway, I find.

[Efrogwr]

Perhaps I could convince someone to start making my dream invention; a chain consisting of 57 inner plates and 57 powerlinks...

You could do it yourself

Like most good or mad ideas to do with bikes, someone has already done it.  I can't find it on Google Images now though.

It doesn't surprise me. Could it be Frank Berto or a Sheldonite? Berto once made a hybrid chain using Shimano outer links and Suntour inners, because he reckoned that Shimano chains changed up better, and Suntour were better changing down.

[rafletcher]

The SRAM powerlinks for 10sp are not reusable (officially) and take some breaking (a pair of pliers or the specialist Park Tool chain plier)  but Connex 10sp are easily reusable - breakable by hand.

[sletti]

Perhaps I could convince someone to start making my dream invention; a chain consisting of 57 inner plates and 57 powerlinks...

You could do it yourself

Like most good or mad ideas to do with bikes, someone has already done it.  I can't find it on Google Images now though.

It doesn't surprise me. Could it be Frank Berto or a Sheldonite? Berto once made a hybrid chain using Shimano outer links and Suntour inners, because he reckoned that Shimano chains changed up better, and Suntour were better changing down.

Some people definitely have too much time on their hands!

I must admit I have never used a suntour chain. In my six speed days, Sedis was the brand of choice, but since then it has been Shimano. It was grand in the good old days when you could mix and match between all of the manufacturers (suntour mech, Simplex levers, Sedis chain, Maillard block, Mavic chainset), but now you have to commit to one brand for a drive train. Anyway, I digress.

After a post mortem on the offending item, I can now see what must be the joining pin, but my confidence in this chain is toast so I'll wait for the SRAM chain before venturing out on this machine again.

Thanks for all the perspective though.

[salar55]

Bought a pile of Mavic chains 10 speed very cheap, £5 each worth a try.  Good buy no problems, same link as Connex might even be Connex.    Have a record one gathering dust need to bin the jointing link and try it with a Connex link

[Adam]

If you carefully line things up, you don't end up with a sliver of metal breaking off.

Are you sure, because how does a pin - that has had its end made larger than the hole - fit through the hole without removing material from the plate?  I don't reckon the steel plate is elastic enough to stretch.  The sliver is small and easy to not notice if it falls on the floor.

I know it can work though (even though a silver comes off) - I've done it myself with peened 8 and 9-speed chains - but I wouldn't recommend it.  Connecting links are nicer to use anyway, I find.

I think about 50% of the time I manage not to create a visible sliver.   

If the pin came out, it must fit back in, that's my philosophy!

[Euan Uzami]

I don't use shimano chains any more because they seem to vibrate which make a horrible noise.
Last time I had one on it would make this faint but really annoying chattering noise whenever i was pedalling - changed the chain for SRAM and silence. SRAM ones are a bit more expensive but can't stand a noisy bike. Although in pretty much everything else gear related I find shimano to be better than SRAM, I've now got entirely shimano gears on both bikes except the chains (and cables).

I also had one come without a joining pin in the pack and had to send it back.