Author Topic: Team CTC?  (Read 2398 times)

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Team CTC?
« on: January 14, 2013, 11:54:39 am »
BC have been treading on CTC toes with Skyride and similar - now CTC go the other way and launch an elite ladies race team.

http://www.ctc.org.uk/national-cycling-charity-launches-women’s-elite-cycling-team

An interesting development. Should this come under cycle promotion, advertising, awareness or campaigning?

..d
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Regulator

  • That's Councillor Regulator to you...
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2013, 12:20:23 pm »
Another waste of money by CTC HQ.  It's almost as though Kevin Mayne hasn't left....
Quote from: clarion
I completely agree with Reg.

Green Party Councillor

Cudzoziemiec

  • Waking up now, put the kettle on!
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2013, 12:21:46 pm »
Well, the CTC mail shot is presenting it as cycle promotion and campaigning. "CTC has supported female cyclists since our earliest days when we took up the case of Lady Harberton, who was banned for wearing 'rational dress' after she cycled to an inn for lunch in 1899.
Over a century later, we are still campaigning to get more women on wheels. Sadly, when it comes to cycling, women are still in the minority, and it concerns us that 99% of sports sponsorship is aimed solely at men." Which is great, but it does seem odd for CTC to get involved in racing. There are non-racing CTC events and campaigns aimed solely at women - here we have a thing called "Get Gorgeous" which takes women newbies and trains them from wobble to riding up Cheddar Gorge. Makes sense. Racing doesn't seem to fit the CTC - but then again, didn't there used to be CTC time trials?
I do not ride a great big Mercian, gangster tanwalls, fixed cog in the back.

TimC

  • Bike pilot
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2013, 12:25:17 pm »
Oh dear. This probably seemed like a good idea when brainstormed in the company of committed yes-men, but I really don't see how racing is or can be an appropriate CTC activity. Surely BC and CTC can get together and agree some delineation of areas of competence?

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2013, 12:43:08 pm »
but then again, didn't there used to be CTC time trials?
Still are or can be.  Some DAs sorry, member groups, are CTT affiliated so that they can organise time trials and their members can ride in other club's events.  This all came about in the 1980s.  Possibly what you are remembering is the old CTC BAR competition which was simply time trial results from CTC members. They could not race in the name of the CTC because the DAs (there I go again) were not RTTC affiliated.  Pre dating that, many racing clubs were offshoots of the local CTC and certainly when I started CTC riding in the late 60s many Sunday rides were in a direction to enable racing members to join us after their time trials.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2013, 12:56:47 pm »
I'm really not sure what to make of this! I think there are some upsides:

- for me, a strength of CTC is embracing different branches of cycling. (Cycle magasine is WAAAAY more varied than Cycling Weekly - which is quite close to being the official BC mag). There will be members who tour and also fancy a bit of racing. Or at least FOLLOW racing.

- It's becoming a bit of a battle out there. BC have very much tried to encroach, so a bit of fighting back may well benefit CTC - if only in publicity/recruitment terms.

(And I like the idea of an anti-lid compulsion body promoting racing :P )
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2013, 01:00:45 pm »
This is why it is awareness/publicity.

BC have been very successful at publicity/promotion and have brought a lot more people into the organisation member fold. Most of these people have never heard of CTC (because the CTC is pretty poor at getting mass public recognition by comparison with BC).

This is the equivalent of Sky getting their logo all over the BBC. I'm ambvalent on this - I can see a justification for it, but whether it is the most effective way of spending money I am not sure.

I'd like to see, as a CTC member of many years, what the expected return on this investment is and how it is expected to benefit CTC aims. What metrics have been put in place to monitor this and how will we know if it is successful.

What is certain is that in making this announcement, CTC have probably generated as many column inches in the cycling press as they had in the whole of last year..
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

JT

  • Howay the lads!
    • CTC Peterborough
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2013, 03:09:27 pm »
I think this is a really positive move by CTC. Aside from the general publicity already mentioned, it positions CTC as something vibrant and positive.

There is no mention anywhere of the financial contribution by CTC but looking at the calibre of riders in the team, and also the other sponsors mentioned in the press release, I would guess that the outlay is pretty low.

Lets hope that where the team is racing in the UK, there is some joined-up thinking and local member groups are utilised in tandem (ahem) with the ambassadors in the team to promote cycling (and CTC).

a great mind thinks alike

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2013, 10:14:43 pm »
Quote
CTC and sponsors will introduce the team on Saturday 19th January

Seems to be a subtle distinction here. Sounds like they've got together a bunch of commercial outfits to put some funding into women's racing - where's the harm in that? Success in sport leads to more people riding bikes whether for sport or leisure - that's good for cycling and so is surely within the remit of CTC.

Many cycling clubs are affiliated to CTC (as well as BC & CTT) and would welcome more women members whatever type of cycling they enjoy so this venture also supports the cycling clubs that CTC represents.

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2013, 10:40:17 pm »
(And I like the idea of an anti-lid compulsion body promoting racing :P )

Except of course, that when Team CTC race they will be required to wear ‘lids’ in all the events they have stated they hope to enter, so they will be supporting compulsory wearing of helmets for racing in accordance with UCI and BC policy.  (I really like the photo accompanying the news release of the women holding the ‘lid’, although perhaps a little more colour co-ordination would have been better.) Whether the CTC ever organise a road race is something we will wait for, but if they do, it will be interesting to see what rules they decide upon and what guidelines they follow regarding helmets.

Without wanting to start a helmet debate, I can only reiterate that apart from racing and young people taking part in Sky Ride events, where the wearing of a helmet is compulsory, BC support the CTC policy in that helmet wearing is a personal choice.  It is not BC policy to make the wearing of helmets mandatory, apart from the cases listed.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2013, 10:49:16 pm »
WARNING: more helmet comment, feel free to ignore!
Without wanting to start a helmet debate, I can only reiterate that apart from racing and young people taking part in Sky Ride events, where the wearing of a helmet is compulsory, BC support the CTC policy in that helmet wearing is a personal choice.  It is not BC policy to make the wearing of helmets mandatory, apart from the cases listed.
CTC don't organise any events that require helmets. (unless there are some off-road ones, which I wouldn't know about)

I would also state that CTC are a lot more overt about opposing compulsion than BC are.
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2013, 10:57:00 pm »
I would suggest that a more careful reading of the BC rulebook may be in order. There are many activities other than racing and Skyride under 16 where helmets are mandated. And strongly recommended for many others.

"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2013, 11:02:10 pm »
CTC don't organise any events that require helmets. (unless there are some off-road ones, which I wouldn't know about)

I would also state that CTC are a lot more overt about opposing compulsion than BC are.

My whole point regarding organising an event refers to a racing event; they will not organise any and the only time you will see Team CTC riding in an event will be when it has been organised by some other body and Team CTC will be wearing helmets.  So associate Team CTC with helmet wearing.

Regarding CTC being overt, a lot of BC members choose to wear helmets because they take part in events where they are mandatory, and they might just even ride a little faster and closer together on some club runs, and consider it appropriate to do so just in case of a spill.  Just because BC do not shout as loud as CTC does not mean their policy differs.

Look forward to the association of CTC with helmet wearing regards Team CTC.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2013, 11:05:54 pm »
  Just because BC do not shout as loud as CTC does not mean their policy differs.
Clearly CTC's policy is to actively oppose compulsion.

Whereas BC simply have a small line somewhere in their literature about it, but in reality do fuck-all, whilst promoting lots of helmet-required events.

That is what the two bodies ACTUALLY do. Very different, I think you can see.
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

mcshroom

  • Mushroom
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2013, 11:08:00 pm »
Please remember this thread is in Racing - If you want to discuss BC and CTC's helmet policies, I'd suggest opening a new thread in Lift the Lid
Climbs like a sprinter, sprints like a climber!

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2013, 11:18:31 pm »
Whereas BC simply have a small line somewhere in their literature about it, but in reality do fuck-all, whilst promoting lots of helmet-required events.

That is what the two bodies ACTUALLY do. Very different, I think you can see.

BC have promoted quite a lot of mass participation events (Sky Ride) and smaller events (Sky Ride Local) to encourage cycling and helmets were not required, unless you were under the age of 16.

I think both bodies ACTUALLY want to encourage cycling.  Very similiar, I think you can see.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2013, 11:24:43 pm »
I think both bodies ACTUALLY want to encourage cycling.  Very similiar, I think you can see.
That's not what we're debating - the relevant fact here is what their public actions are with respect to helmets and their compulsion.

They are both cycling organisations - if either  was opposed to cycling, that would be quite a story!
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2013, 11:37:48 pm »
That's not what we're debating - the relevant fact here is what their public actions are with respect to helmets and their compulsion.
Agreed, and they appear to be very similar; they wear them when mandated and personal choice at other times.

More importantly, I was disappointed with the lack of effort regards the nail varnish in the photo accompanying the news release.  I think it needs to be a more vibrant colour rather than the dowdy brown.

I wish the CTC luck with this, although opinion seems divided on the CTC forum about Team CTC.  Anything that promotes cycling has to be a good thing IMO.

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2013, 08:03:40 am »
A team of mixed elite, 1st and 2nd cat riders...

It doesn't look like a particularly serious venture from here..

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2013, 09:26:29 am »
It's serious enough. It will compete on the UK domestic scene (which is historically not very active for ladies) so E,1,2 is about right to act as a team which can be serious and develop the talent out there. 
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2013, 09:04:09 pm »
It's great news. Something with profile that demonstrates that CTC is for all cyclists, whatever your persuasion or discipline.

Re: Team CTC?
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2013, 09:48:07 pm »
It's great news. Something with profile that demonstrates that CTC is for all cyclists, whatever your persuasion or discipline.

Hear Hear!  :thumbsup: