Author Topic: Cross Training: Running  (Read 444317 times)

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1425 on: 07 December, 2014, 05:46:32 pm »
Quite some achievement CET  :thumbsup: That is a rugged coastline to run along. You deserve a rest and post run massage to help recover.

zigzag

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1426 on: 07 December, 2014, 06:01:16 pm »
terrific effort CET, my running has stopped in january when i was knocked off the bike, took couple of months to heal and just couldn't restart running after that. entered a ballot for london marathon in hope that this will re-ignite my motivation, but didn't get a place and decided to stick to cycling this/next year (got some rollers for when it's cold and icy outside).

well done to all runners posting here - and keep it going! :thumbsup:

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1427 on: 08 December, 2014, 05:04:58 pm »
60th out of 110 finishers and 166 starters
Eddington Numbers 130 (imperial), 183 (metric) 574 (furlongs)  116 (nautical miles)

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1428 on: 08 December, 2014, 05:43:40 pm »
Incredible effort, CET. Chapeau.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1429 on: 12 December, 2014, 09:32:21 pm »
The sort of feat I can't even imagine, CET.

And back at rather shorter distances, I did my second proper 'long slow run' at lunchtime. Am I allowed to be a little peeved that the time for 10k was one hour and ten seconds? Actually I'm pretty pleased with the time, but if I'd only known how close I was...

"No matter how slow you go, you're still lapping everybody on the couch."

mattc

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1430 on: 12 December, 2014, 10:55:18 pm »
WTF is the point of a "long slow run" if you're going to worry about times?
Has never ridden RAAM
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No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

citoyen

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1431 on: 13 December, 2014, 12:12:52 am »
Slow is relative, innit? Too slow and it loses its training value.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1432 on: 19 December, 2014, 09:44:30 pm »
Blog for the Dorset Coast Ultra has now been written.

https://crazyenglishtriathlete.wordpress.com/2014/12/19/the-dorset-coast-ultra/

Eddington Numbers 130 (imperial), 183 (metric) 574 (furlongs)  116 (nautical miles)

mattc

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1433 on: 22 December, 2014, 07:06:51 pm »
Slow is relative, innit? Too slow and it loses its training value.
Sorry,  I'm very late in disagreeing with you :)

But I don't agree - you cannot go so slow as to get *no* training value. All miles give adaptations.
(Ill dig out some references to refute your next post when it arrives :P I know there are plenty of runners who juist dont believe in running slowly - every run is either "quite hard","intervals" or "race pace". Old skool! ) 


Meanwhile,  I'm quavering over entering https://www.jantastic.me/rules/ (YACF team, obviously - cos my 'proper' club membership has lapsed ).
This is the first December I've been running regulary injury-free (albeit tiny miles),  BUT every other time I've commited to running 'things' it has resulted in injury soon after. Can I avoid the curse this time?!? A week to decide...
Has never ridden RAAM
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No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1434 on: 22 December, 2014, 07:15:00 pm »
WTF is the point of a "long slow run" if you're going to worry about times?
And I'm very late in commenting about this!
I wasn't worrying about the time while I was running. It was just that when I got home about five hours later (run was lunchtime), I noted that the time was so annoyingly over the hour!
"No matter how slow you go, you're still lapping everybody on the couch."

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1435 on: 23 December, 2014, 11:22:41 am »
But I don't agree - you cannot go so slow as to get *no* training value. All miles give adaptations.

I'll be interested to see your references. My understanding is that any exercise has to at least elevate your heart rate significantly above normal for your efforts to have any training value - otherwise you might as well say that just getting out of bed in the morning is training.

But my understanding may be wrong - it wouldn't be the first time.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1436 on: 23 December, 2014, 02:46:01 pm »
If walking is better than nothing (and it surely is) then it doesn't matter how slowly you run in empirical terms, though obviously it does matter for any training plan how slowly you run- for you.

Just IMO, obviously.


mattc

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1437 on: 24 December, 2014, 06:43:17 pm »
Sorry for the delay, hopefully this is in time for boab and cit to plan their pre-xmaslunch runs!

A quick google produced this page which looks at some of the science. http://runnersconnect.net/coach-corner/optimal-long-run-pace/

Here's the summary:
Quote
The body of evidence is clear, your optimal long run pace is between 55 and 75 percent of your 5k pace, with the average pace being about 65 percent.

It’s also evident from this research that running faster than 75% of your 5k pace on your long run doesn’t provide a lot of additional physiological benefit. Therefore, pushing the pace beyond 75% of 5k pace only serves to make you more tired and hamper recovery.

In fact, the research indicates that it would be just as advantageous to run slower as it would be to run faster. 50-55 percent of 5k pace is pretty easy, but the research clearly demonstrates that it still provides near optimal physiological benefits.


If you’re feeling tired and the long run isn’t scheduled to be a hard day, don’t be afraid to slow your long run down. My suggestion is to start on the slower side of the pace recommendations (50% of 5k pace) and slowly pick it up through the run if you feel good.
(my bold)

I think you'll agree that 50% of your 5k PB pace is v v slow indeed! Thats ~14min-mile pace for me. I suspect I only jog that slowly between hard intervals, if at all.

Two waffly points that I believe back all this up*:
- at any speed/effort, no matter how slow, your body makes efficiency adaptations. Physios talk about stuff like "muscle firing sequences". This is why a slow run is better than - say - a slow bike ride, for running purposes. And;
- the reasons to avoid overdoing the long run are to keep some energy back for the more focused sessions, and to minimise your injury risk (injuries correlate strongly with your overall weekly training load,  especially overtraining).


*(based on papers wot I have read,  but cannot quote here!)
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1438 on: 24 December, 2014, 07:35:17 pm »
I think you'll agree that 50% of your 5k PB pace is v v slow indeed! Thats ~14min-mile pace for me. I suspect I only jog that slowly between hard intervals, if at all.

50% of my 5k pace would barely amount to a brisk walk! My pre-Xmas lunch run will be a parkrun, so I'll be aiming to be a wee bit quicker than that.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

mattc

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1439 on: 26 December, 2014, 05:39:45 pm »
Having done quite a few 30min+ runs now (albeit pretty slowly) without issues,  ive talked myself into doing tomorrow's parkRun. I'll delay registering for jantastic until Sunday,  in case something flares up tomorrow and I have to let down the YACF team before I even start!

2ry Hazards:
- it will be muddy. My trusted trail-shoes are worn to uselessness,  so I'll have to use the new ones which are almost untested.
- It will be 1'c. Fine for the run,  but I've totally forgotten what clothes to wear/take on the ride to/from! Much more complicated than just doing a 90min ride. Oh well, it'll probably work out ...
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1440 on: 13 January, 2015, 08:53:45 am »
Fastest 5K Ever!!!!!!!!!

Well today doing 2 min run / 30 sec walk intervals I ran my fastest ever 5k with 6.59 km's.

I've never run that fast usually bouncing around 7.30 a km and more usually 8.30 a km.

I'm so chuffed, shame I now have to go to the dentist.

D.
Somewhat of a professional tea drinker.


citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1441 on: 13 January, 2015, 10:23:19 am »
I've totally forgotten what clothes to wear/take on the ride to/from!

Don't over-think it. I just wear my running gear for my four mile ride to parkrun, with a softshell over the top if it's cold, and my running shoes in my saddlebag to change into when I get there. If it's a shorts day, not quite cold enough for running in leggings, I might wear knee warmers for the ride as well.

In summer, I have been known to wear my trisuit, but I don't think I could get into that at the moment even if I wanted to.

Fastest 5K Ever!!!!!!!!!

Well done! The run/walk strategy sounds like a very sensible approach.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1442 on: 13 January, 2015, 10:41:53 am »

Fastest 5K Ever!!!!!!!!!

Well done! The run/walk strategy sounds like a very sensible approach.

I had a thought that given I use variable intervals to build up to 5k why not use them to improve my pace rather than just going for it wearing myself out and then walking or giving up.  I found myself pushing more given that I knew I could rest for 30 seconds. Funny thing was when I finished I felt like I had more in the tank so I suspect that number can and will come down over the next few months.

The annoying thing is of course is about a year ago I was happily running 20k with no breaks up hill and down dale and then I sprained my ankle power kiting and the weight just piled on and my motivation vanished. Weddings of course are massive motivators and I refuse to look like a lard boy on my own wedding day in July so It's all go.

D.
Somewhat of a professional tea drinker.


CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1443 on: 15 January, 2015, 06:39:06 am »
Escaped Hull Road Travelodge last night for a run around Heslington Common and down to Poole Bridge and back.  Mostly off road, except for the bit through Heslington.  Flat as a pancake except for the A64 flyover.  Nice strong headwind spitting rain at me on the way out and big fast tailwind on the way back.  Wasn't as fast as I expected but legs are in good nick this morning given it was the first run since the Ultra 6 weeks ago.  Going to stick to my promise not to enter any running events this year but enjoy a run like this every week or two as cross-training / escape from office + train + hotel drudgery.  9.4 miles
Eddington Numbers 130 (imperial), 183 (metric) 574 (furlongs)  116 (nautical miles)

αdαmsκι

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1444 on: 15 January, 2015, 06:43:22 am »
A 15 km run after a six week break is impressive.
What on earth am I doing here on this beautiful day?! This is the only life I've got!!

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CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1445 on: 16 January, 2015, 11:27:35 am »
Soft ground.  Nice on the joints.  Have also been on the rowing machine and loosened the legs on the Poor Student audax. 
Eddington Numbers 130 (imperial), 183 (metric) 574 (furlongs)  116 (nautical miles)

αdαmsκι

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1446 on: 21 January, 2015, 07:30:37 pm »
This evening I extended my run commute up to 16 km. It was bloomin' cold to start with and even once I was warmed up I wasn't removing my hat or gloves.

This time last year the longest run I'd done was 10 km, and I was doing 19 minute ParkRuns, whereas this year I've already done a number of 15 km runs and my ParkRun times are a minute faster. Hopefully that will all mean a faster London marathon time. But, first stretches, shower & food.
What on earth am I doing here on this beautiful day?! This is the only life I've got!!

https://tyredandhungry.wordpress.com/

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1447 on: 23 January, 2015, 02:54:50 pm »
I took the opportunity to have run along the Grand Union canal towpath whilst at Teethgrinder's place. Longest run so far this year of 3 hours, ~20 miles to Stoke Bruerne and back. Lovely day bright winters day to be out with the right layers as it was barely above freezing even at midday, the canal was frozen solid in most places. There's an interesting 19th century iron aquaduct over the river Ouze just north of Wolverton.

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1448 on: 24 January, 2015, 09:01:09 am »
Good going Swiss Hat. 

Can't fit a cycle ride in this weekend so went out for a run in the dark, three laps of my suburb, which is just under 6 miles but added in intervals up the steep hill (rises 25m in 200m and the second half is significantly steeper than the half) x2 on the first lap and x3 on the next two laps.  Gathering by how sleepy I felt after breakfast it was a good workout and I think I will repeat it.  (I should have done x4 on the last lap but I lost count and was halfway home before I realised - so they must have been good intervals.
Eddington Numbers 130 (imperial), 183 (metric) 574 (furlongs)  116 (nautical miles)

Re: Cross Training: Running
« Reply #1449 on: 24 January, 2015, 11:27:53 am »
Nice running Swiss H. I had to look up that viaduct, although I couldn't find many photos of it. The GoogleStreetview trike has clearly been along the canal towpath though :)

For aquaduct officianados (there must be some out there):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosgrove_aqueduct

The Pontcysyllte aquaduct mentioned in the Wiki article is crossed on foot during John Hamilton's Offa's Dyke 600. Not recommended for vertigo sufferers as there is a 126 foot drop on one side and water on the other. Hope that John will revive the event in the future - it was a classic.