Author Topic: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact  (Read 7262 times)

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

  • Miles eaten don't satisfy hunger
  • Chartered accountant in 5 different decades
    • CET Ride Reports and Blogs
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #75 on: January 04, 2020, 03:18:04 pm »
I've never owned a motor mower.  But its quite hard to buy a decent push mower.  Garden machinery manufacturers are more interested in fleecing the punters than being environmentally friendly.

And leaf blowers  :demon: :demon: :demon:  I have about 1000 square foot of lawn which takes 10 minutes to clear with a garden rake and is a rather therapeutic activity.   Its one of the larger lawns in the street but I seem to be the only person that doesn't use a leafblower, which would take about the same time, judging by observations of its use.
Eddington Numbers 125 (imperial), 170 (metric) 520 (furlongs)  112 (nautical miles)

fboab

  • It's a fecking serious business, riding a bike
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #76 on: January 04, 2020, 03:49:32 pm »
Wine is no longer from outside Europe.
My current employ is bottling wine, 95% of which is from outside Europe. We're carbon negative because we generate from solar and wind turbines. Our warehouses are heated from ground pumps and we have innovative solutions to generate heat from disused mines. Long distance wine travels by boat in tanks or containers because shipping glass is really expensive. Your European wine travels by road, in bottles, It's not any more sustainable than the Chilean stuff that's shipped on a slow boat, hauled less than 20 miles from a port to a hilltop in County Durham, and then enters the retail chain through central hubs.

If you want to reduce the impact of your wine, buy bag in box. Bottles are heavy.

On a personal level, I've had 4 children so anything else I do is pissing in the wind. I think society may thank me in the end though, as they will be economically active in the aging society for longer than I will.
TSS is not Total Sex Score, Chris!

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #77 on: January 04, 2020, 04:09:07 pm »
My 4 children likewise. What is more, two of them are employed in highly sustainable careers (an energy consultant and a webcast designer/manager). The others are a teacher and a senior bod in a charity, so all working for the betterment of the planet/humans.
Eating's a serious business. Don't bollocks around wagging your tail.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #78 on: January 04, 2020, 04:15:38 pm »
Wine is no longer from outside Europe.
My current employ is bottling wine, 95% of which is from outside Europe. We're carbon negative because we generate from solar and wind turbines. Our warehouses are heated from ground pumps and we have innovative solutions to generate heat from disused mines. Long distance wine travels by boat in tanks or containers because shipping glass is really expensive. Your European wine travels by road, in bottles, It's not any more sustainable than the Chilean stuff that's shipped on a slow boat, hauled less than 20 miles from a port to a hilltop in County Durham, and then enters the retail chain through central hubs.

If you want to reduce the impact of your wine, buy bag in box. Bottles are heavy.


That's interesting, last time I read up I think bottles from France were lower CO2 per 750ml than bulk from Australia.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #79 on: January 04, 2020, 04:21:35 pm »
CET if they still make it the husqvarna push mower is a good option

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #80 on: January 04, 2020, 04:33:45 pm »
I've never owned a motor mower.  But its quite hard to buy a decent push mower.  Garden machinery manufacturers are more interested in fleecing the punters than being environmentally friendly.

And leaf blowers  :demon: :demon: :demon:  I have about 1000 square foot of lawn which takes 10 minutes to clear with a garden rake and is a rather therapeutic activity.   Its one of the larger lawns in the street but I seem to be the only person that doesn't use a leafblower, which would take about the same time, judging by observations of its use.
Or just leave the leaves on the lawn, the worms pull them down into the ground - about as natural and environmentally friendly as it gets. Some of my neighbours use leaf blowers and my grass is as good and clear of leaves in the spring as theirs

(a while ago I seen one clown drying his urban battle tank with a leaf blower, i was tempted to stop and video but he looked a bit pumped up) 

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #81 on: January 04, 2020, 05:00:52 pm »
Of course, the solar-PV landscape has changed somewhat, and these days it makes sense (FCVO sense) to dump excess PV-generated electricity into a hot water tank rather than feeding it back to the grid.  It's probably a more productive use of valuable roof space.

Kim, can you explain a bit more about this to an electron numpty?  I thought that using solar electricity to power anything with a heating element - kettle, toaster, immersion heater - was much more demanding on the system and much less efficient than, say, driving a motor - eg fridge, hoover.  Have I got the concept wrong, as I've never heard of using solar electricity to heat water via an immersion heater?  Perhaps it wouldn't be via an immersion heater but some other device?

It's a relevant question to me at the moment, as I consider whether to have the solar water heating array renewed (dismantled when relevant roof was being replaced (in 2016!) and not yet reinstated.  The idea of solar panels as an alternative is intriguing...

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #82 on: January 04, 2020, 05:49:52 pm »
Of course, the solar-PV landscape has changed somewhat, and these days it makes sense (FCVO sense) to dump excess PV-generated electricity into a hot water tank rather than feeding it back to the grid.  It's probably a more productive use of valuable roof space.

Kim, can you explain a bit more about this to an electron numpty?  I thought that using solar electricity to power anything with a heating element - kettle, toaster, immersion heater - was much more demanding on the system and much less efficient than, say, driving a motor - eg fridge, hoover.  Have I got the concept wrong, as I've never heard of using solar electricity to heat water via an immersion heater?  Perhaps it wouldn't be via an immersion heater but some other device?

It's a relevant question to me at the moment, as I consider whether to have the solar water heating array renewed (dismantled when relevant roof was being replaced (in 2016!) and not yet reinstated.  The idea of solar panels as an alternative is intriguing...

i'm not Kim but I will give it a go - a little device known as a diverter directs any excess energy from the solar panels into the hot water tank.  it is possibly beneficial as the price the power company pay you for excess generation is about 4p per kwh where as you may be paying 14p per kwh   (bear in mind though gas is only about 4p per kwh (before efficient losses)  )

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #83 on: January 04, 2020, 06:07:18 pm »
Of course, the solar-PV landscape has changed somewhat, and these days it makes sense (FCVO sense) to dump excess PV-generated electricity into a hot water tank rather than feeding it back to the grid.  It's probably a more productive use of valuable roof space.

Kim, can you explain a bit more about this to an electron numpty?  I thought that using solar electricity to power anything with a heating element - kettle, toaster, immersion heater - was much more demanding on the system and much less efficient than, say, driving a motor - eg fridge, hoover.  Have I got the concept wrong, as I've never heard of using solar electricity to heat water via an immersion heater?  Perhaps it wouldn't be via an immersion heater but some other device?

It's a relevant question to me at the moment, as I consider whether to have the solar water heating array renewed (dismantled when relevant roof was being replaced (in 2016!) and not yet reinstated.  The idea of solar panels as an alternative is intriguing...

i'm not Kim but I will give it a go - a little device known as a diverter directs any excess energy from the solar panels into the hot water tank.  it is possibly beneficial as the price the power company pay you for excess generation is about 4p per kwh where as you may be paying 14p per kwh   (bear in mind though gas is only about 4p per kwh (before efficient losses)  )

I see, but would that be delivered to the standard 3kW immersion heater, or via some other device?

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #84 on: January 04, 2020, 06:53:38 pm »
Of course, the solar-PV landscape has changed somewhat, and these days it makes sense (FCVO sense) to dump excess PV-generated electricity into a hot water tank rather than feeding it back to the grid.  It's probably a more productive use of valuable roof space.

Kim, can you explain a bit more about this to an electron numpty?  I thought that using solar electricity to power anything with a heating element - kettle, toaster, immersion heater - was much more demanding on the system and much less efficient than, say, driving a motor - eg fridge, hoover.  Have I got the concept wrong, as I've never heard of using solar electricity to heat water via an immersion heater?  Perhaps it wouldn't be via an immersion heater but some other device?

It's a relevant question to me at the moment, as I consider whether to have the solar water heating array renewed (dismantled when relevant roof was being replaced (in 2016!) and not yet reinstated.  The idea of solar panels as an alternative is intriguing...

i'm not Kim but I will give it a go - a little device known as a diverter directs any excess energy from the solar panels into the hot water tank.  it is possibly beneficial as the price the power company pay you for excess generation is about 4p per kwh where as you may be paying 14p per kwh   (bear in mind though gas is only about 4p per kwh (before efficient losses)  )

I see, but would that be delivered to the standard 3kW immersion heater, or via some other device?
(not 100% certain), but an immersion type heater is a pure resistive load therefor if the solar panels are only delivering 1000w then the heater would be giving out pretty close to a 1000w of heat energy.  not at all sure about efficiencies so at very low output may be no energy would get transferred ?

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #85 on: January 04, 2020, 07:32:42 pm »
Some interesting ideas and Greenbank's list is pretty comprehensive, but does anyone think it'll make enough of a difference?
I can't see it, maybe if everyone in the developed world did everything on that list and the rest of the worlds population remained at their current sustenance or below level we'd survive.  It isn't feasible for the entire world population could have that lifestyle, is it?  All we're doing, all we can do, is find better ways to maintain the same lifestyle, when what needs to be done is to find a different way of living.  A better way to cut he grass, a better way to cross the continent to go skiing, longer lasting bike tyres... I'm not knocking any of it, I'm just dubious that it'll make any difference to saving the planet. 
Can I ask how much of your working life has been necessary? I'd guess about 20% of mine has been the processing, production and distribution of essentials, maybe another 30% has been slightly beneficial to others.  That leaves half of it a waste of effort and resource, giving people what they certainly don't need and probably don't want but have to have because everyone else does. And I've never done much work!

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #86 on: January 04, 2020, 07:45:31 pm »
It is rather a big problem to all the other species that we share the planet with.  They have as much right to it as we do.

Again, only the ones that feel the need to reproduce. It probably won't be an issue for, say, pandas.
You could also argue that we're actually doing far more good to other species by wiping ourselves out than we ever would by preventing warming in the first place.

I've seen it suggested that the effect may be self-limiting in as much that humans become measurably more stupid as CO2 levels pass the 1000ppm range, and at some point we may lose the ability to use fossil fuel technology.

I'm not convinced.  Small numbers of sufficiently well-off humans would surely be able to scrub CO2 from their own personal air supply, and that of whatever supply chain was required to keep them in appropriate luxury, until everything was properly fucked.
Surely the issue with co2 though is that it’sa greenhouse gas, not that you breathe it in...
If it got to the point where you notice the concentration in what you breathe in then the greenhouse gas effect would have been, well, far more of a problem.

Well off humans by definition reproduce less than poorer ones as we’ve discussed. So after a bit you might get to the point that their filtration devices (if they’re ever a thing) would simply become so  disproportionately valuable they wouldn’t be able to protect them sufficiently and they would simply get nicked.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #87 on: January 04, 2020, 07:57:41 pm »
I do wonder how much of my bike has flown to Europe, and how much has travelled by ship.
I tried to find that answer to that, but nothing that really gives a clue.  I was shocked at how many parts from the big suppliers were flown, it's possible that a customer in the UK could buy from a UK chain and that it's be flown in from somewhere else and they wouldn't necessarily know, there's nothing on the label to say that, it might not even be labelled till in the UK.
Part of this is the next day culture, just look at the reviews here and everywhere else - great service.. ordered lunchtime yesterday... here at breakfast today... that's not my idea of great service it's a wasteful use of resource.  I've never needed a bike part the next day, I wouldn't admit the incompetence if I had.  I can't think when I've ever needed anything sent next day, if there was a supplier that said they dispatch on a Friday, would it make any difference?  I'd use them.  Maybe we could even have a universal delivery day, like bin day, all your streets deliveries in one shipment once a week, think of the waste it'd save.  I spent the run up to the Christmas before last (2018) working for a major clothing chain (Yes I do make a habit of working seasonally, so I can skive off other times of the year) They don't only suffer from next day syndrome, but they've added free returns, returns rate was 40%, that's not people changing their minds, that's ordering before you've made your mind up.  Anyone seeing the scale of it and still thinking it's free, would be an idiot.
Rant over - I thought I had a point when I started...

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #88 on: January 04, 2020, 08:07:59 pm »
Some interesting ideas and Greenbank's list is pretty comprehensive, but does anyone think it'll make enough of a difference?
I can't see it, maybe if everyone in the developed world did everything on that list and the rest of the worlds population remained at their current sustenance or below level we'd survive.  It isn't feasible for the entire world population could have that lifestyle, is it? All we're doing, all we can do, is find better ways to maintain the same lifestyle, when what needs to be done is to find a different way of living.  A better way to cut he grass, a better way to cross the continent to go skiing, longer lasting bike tyres... I'm not knocking any of it, I'm just dubious that it'll make any difference to saving the planet. 
Can I ask how much of your working life has been necessary? I'd guess about 20% of mine has been the processing, production and distribution of essentials, maybe another 30% has been slightly beneficial to others.  That leaves half of it a waste of effort and resource, giving people what they certainly don't need and probably don't want but have to have because everyone else does. And I've never done much work!
indeed,  less than a billion of us have made nearly all the environmental damage we have today and another 6 billion would like to adopt our lifestyles.  Therefor even if we reduced our excesses by 86%  before passing on our lifestyles to the rest of the world, we would not have improved anything. It's a daunting uphill struggle.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #89 on: January 04, 2020, 08:11:35 pm »
It's not a zero sum game, though.
Reducing the CO2 level in the atmosphere is essential.
Reducing the usage of non-renewable materials and resources is essential.
However, with renewable stuff, which includes food, for instance, there is the chance for technological improvements to be made which will help.
"No matter how slow you go, you're still lapping everybody on the couch."

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #90 on: January 04, 2020, 08:27:16 pm »
However, with renewable stuff, which includes food, for instance, there is the chance for technological improvements to be made which will help.
30% of food grown isn't eaten. That isn't a technological issue.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #91 on: January 04, 2020, 09:05:32 pm »
Wine is no longer from outside Europe.
My current employ is bottling wine, 95% of which is from outside Europe. We're carbon negative because we generate from solar and wind turbines. Our warehouses are heated from ground pumps and we have innovative solutions to generate heat from disused mines. Long distance wine travels by boat in tanks or containers because shipping glass is really expensive. Your European wine travels by road, in bottles, It's not any more sustainable than the Chilean stuff that's shipped on a slow boat, hauled less than 20 miles from a port to a hilltop in County Durham, and then enters the retail chain through central hubs.

If you want to reduce the impact of your wine, buy bag in box. Bottles are heavy.

On a personal level, I've had 4 children so anything else I do is pissing in the wind. I think society may thank me in the end though, as they will be economically active in the aging society for longer than I will.

That’s great, but unless I’m reading it wrong the minimum volume of a BIB is 1.5 litres... if there’s three off us and one doesn’t drink more than one or two small glasses, does that consign me to getting pissed as a loon every time we open one?
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #92 on: January 04, 2020, 09:45:46 pm »
Wine is no longer from outside Europe.
My current employ is bottling wine, 95% of which is from outside Europe. We're carbon negative because we generate from solar and wind turbines. Our warehouses are heated from ground pumps and we have innovative solutions to generate heat from disused mines. Long distance wine travels by boat in tanks or containers because shipping glass is really expensive. Your European wine travels by road, in bottles, It's not any more sustainable than the Chilean stuff that's shipped on a slow boat, hauled less than 20 miles from a port to a hilltop in County Durham, and then enters the retail chain through central hubs.

If you want to reduce the impact of your wine, buy bag in box. Bottles are heavy.

On a personal level, I've had 4 children so anything else I do is pissing in the wind. I think society may thank me in the end though, as they will be economically active in the aging society for longer than I will.

That’s great, but unless I’m reading it wrong the minimum volume of a BIB is 1.5 litres... if there’s three off us and one doesn’t drink more than one or two small glasses, does that consign me to getting pissed as a loon every time we open one?
Sounds reasonable to me  :thumbsup:
Or find a wine you like that comes in a 10 litre box and bottle it yourself, just keep reusing the bottles.
There's a problem with recycling green glass, as 60% of it's imported, either full or empty bottles, no one in the UK wants more than they can use.

OT - What happened to the pub carry out?  Did the supermarkets kill that as well.  The local where I was a kid had a hatch just inside the door, and people used to get their own bottles or jugs filled with beer, I haven't seen it since.

fboab

  • It's a fecking serious business, riding a bike
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #93 on: January 04, 2020, 09:54:55 pm »
Recycling figures for glass bottles isn't that great, even aside from the colour issue. And surely you both know that there's no need to bottle it yourself, the bag keeps the wine OK for weeks? There really is no need to polish it off in one sitting.

(As an aside the only 10 litre packs we do are altar wine )
TSS is not Total Sex Score, Chris!

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #94 on: January 04, 2020, 09:59:13 pm »
And surely you both know that there's no need to bottle it yourself, the bag keeps the wine OK for weeks?
Yes, but there's something about opening a bottle and finishing one off, that's lost straight from the box.

fuaran

  • rothair gasta
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #95 on: January 04, 2020, 10:56:14 pm »
Recycling figures for glass bottles isn't that great, even aside from the colour issue. And surely you both know that there's no need to bottle it yourself, the bag keeps the wine OK for weeks? There really is no need to polish it off in one sitting.
How do you dispose of the plastic bag?

Clare

  • Is home
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #96 on: January 04, 2020, 11:09:14 pm »
Open the tap, blow the bag up, close the tap, instant pillow.

Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #97 on: January 04, 2020, 11:28:11 pm »
Making small changes that feel like fiddling around the edges TBH.
Living in Bermuda its tough to adhere to a green lifestyle. I think its probably a common thread in many small Island nations.
To some degree larger changes can be cost prohibitive and impractical due to remoteness.
The recycling for example is appalling, but we are 700 miles offshore and don't have the infrastructure to deal with much of it.
Things that drive us nuts... You can literally see the turtles in the water that will swallow the helium balloons that have not been banned yet. FFS
Awareness is growing, particularly among the young folks, but being green is also construed as elitist in some circles.

Small stuff we have done ourselves.
Installing solar and battery back up to get off grid as much as we can.
We fly less, usually once a year to Europe and stay for an innings. We vacation rent our house here while away so its not sitting empty.
Water catchment on roofs with filter system.
We are tearing up most of the lawn to plant fruit trees and veg garden.
Next car will be electric but limited choices here due to size restrictions.
I shop by bike whenever I can and we eat local in season fish and veg whenever possible.
All wood debris on grounds now chipped, mulched on site, not trucked.
Reduced meat consumption and only ethical/grass fed/organic (read elitist)
Compost everything.
Use alternatives to plastic wrap etc.

I just wish the powers that be would get it together and make these decisions for us.
often lost.

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

  • Miles eaten don't satisfy hunger
  • Chartered accountant in 5 different decades
    • CET Ride Reports and Blogs
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #98 on: January 05, 2020, 05:48:46 am »
Some interesting ideas and Greenbank's list is pretty comprehensive, but does anyone think it'll make enough of a difference?


IMHO it's part of the solution.  If the big energy consumers in the rich world (and that includes significant parts of China and some of India's population among others) reduce their consumption, it makes it easier to replace our current dependence on coal/oil/gas directly or for electricity generation.  The other part of the solution is to generate more renewable energy (which to give the UK government its due - there are plans for extensive expansion of our offshore wind power among other things.

It's not a battle which can be won overnight, and there are major social consequences. If we all give up meat, then all those UK farmers who earn a living from raising livestock will be out of business, which could destroy a lot of rural communities.  It will also make changes to that rural landscape we cycle through - a lot of grazing land is the way it is because it is either too prone to flooding or too poor in nutrients for growing crops.
Eddington Numbers 125 (imperial), 170 (metric) 520 (furlongs)  112 (nautical miles)

fboab

  • It's a fecking serious business, riding a bike
Re: Changes You've Made that (Might) Have a Climate Impact
« Reply #99 on: January 05, 2020, 08:17:38 am »
Recycling figures for glass bottles isn't that great, even aside from the colour issue. And surely you both know that there's no need to bottle it yourself, the bag keeps the wine OK for weeks? There really is no need to polish it off in one sitting.
How do you dispose of the plastic bag?
By the end of February they'll be EVOH. Cut the tap off, rinse it out, and recycle where any carrier bag goes - that's mostly supermarkets, local authorities tend not to have facilities for it. Taps go for energy from waste.
TSS is not Total Sex Score, Chris!